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Question Phoenix AZ HDTV ( AVS Forum Local HDTV Info and Reception )
Updated: 2008-05-23 09:31:53 (5902)
Phoenix AZ HDTV

Digital/HD Channel Lineup for Metro Phoenix. Lloyd (from the AZ HDTV Forums - link in my profile) has developed a Google spreadsheet outling the digital and HD channels that are available from all providers to the Metro Phoenix area. This grid is much more useful than the list that was previously included in this post.

Metro Phoenix Digital/HD Channel Grid

Clear QAM Channel Lineup. The following is the clear QAM lineup available on standard Cox systems, which includes most of the Phoenix area except for some areas of Tempe and Glendale. A clear QAM tuner and subscription to basic cable are required to receive these channels.
Code:
RF Ch    Resolution  Cox  Name       Remap  Affiliation
072-5*   528x480i    14   AZNEWS            
076-1    1280x720p   710  KSAZ-DT    0.710  Fox HD
076-2    1920x1080i  706  KASW-DT    0.706  CW HD
080-4    544x480i    21   KPAZ              TBN
080-5    544x480i    06   KASW              CW
080-6    544x480i    17   KPPX              ION
080-7    544x480i    13   KAZT              AZ TV
080-8    544x480i    19   KTVW              Univision
081-77#  544x480i    07   Cox 7             
085-11   528x480i    2    CSPAN             
085-12   528x480i    125  CSPAN2            
086-24*  528x480i    96   HSN               
087-11*  528x480i    500  PPVPB             
087-15*  528x480i    1    CLIC              
088-1    528x480i    650  NBAB              
095-1%   544x480i    22   LEASED            
101-2    528x480i    115  MCTV              
101-12   528x480i    122  Pentagon          
102-8*   528x480i    16   TBS               
103-1    544x480i    9    KUTP              MNTV
103-3*   544x480i    99   know99            
103-4*   544x480i    11   PHX11             
103-5*   528x480i    8    KAET              PBS
103-6*   544x480i    15   KNXV              ABC
103-7*   544x480i    5    KPHO              CBS
103-8*   544x480i    12   KPNX              NBC
103-9*   544x480i    10   KSAZ              Fox
103-10*  544x480i    3    KTVK              Ind
105-1    1280x720p   708  KAET-DT-1  0.708  PBS HD
105-2    1920x1080i  712  KPNX-DT-1  0.712  NBC HD
105-3    704x480i    80   KAET-DT-2  0.80   KAET Create
105-4    704x480i    83   KPNX-DT-2  0.83   NBC Weather+
105-5    704x480i    88   KAET-DT-3  0.85   PBS World
106-1    1280x720p   715  KNXV-DT-1  0.715  ABC HD
106-2    1920x1080i  705  KPHO-DT-1  0.705  CBS HD
106-4*   704x480i    85   KPHO-DT-2  0.85   CBS 5 Weather Now
106-5*   704x480i    95   KNXV-DT-2  0.95   GoAZ.TV (traffic)
108-1    1920x1080i  703  KTVK-DT    1.703  KTVK HD
108-3*   1280x720p   709  KUTP-DT-1  0.709  MNTV HD
110-3    528x480i    97   TVGC              
110-4    528x480i    20   KTAZ              Telemundo
110-5    528x480i    18   WGN
* May show on a different subchannel due to nonsequential programs
# May not map on all tuners
% 64QAM modulation instead of the normal 256

Cable TV Channel Frequencies. Users of MythTV and other PC tuning cards can use the Cable TV Channel Frequency Chart in conjuction with the Clear QAM Channel Lineup above to calculate cable QAM frequencies needed to tune the unencrypted channels.

Cable TV Channel Frequeny Chart
  1. Use the Clear QAM List to find the desired Cox channel and locate the corresponding RF Channel number.
  2. Then locate that RF Channel number in the Channel Designation-EIA/NCTA column in the Cable TV Chart.
  3. Now look across to the Visual Carrier-Standard column to find the corresponding Base Frequency.
  4. Add 1.75 to this number to calculate the applicable cable frequency.
For example: Cox Channel 705 (CBS-KPHO) is RF Channel 106 in the Clear QAM List. This equates to a Base Frequency of 685.25 in the Cable TV Chart. Adding 1.75 results in a QAM Frequency of 687, the same number displayed in the Cox Diagnostics Display screens.

Cox SDV Channels.
Code:
109 Cox Real Estate 2
110 Daystar
112 INSP
113 EWTN
114 BYU-TV
125 C-SPAN 2
126 C-SPAN 3
133 DIY
144 Fox Reality Channel
155 BET Jazz
156 Great American Country
157 Fuse
158 G4
159 Logo
163 Fit TV
170 Fox College Sports Atlantic
172 Fox College Sports Pacific
173 Fuel
405 TV Chile
410 De Pelicula
411 De Pelicula Clasico
412 CineLatino
413 VeneMovies
417 History en Espanol
418 Discovery en Espanol
422 Discovery Familia
423 TOON Disney en Espanol
424 Boomerang en Espanol
425 Sorpresa
430 MTV Tres
432 Bandamax
433 VideoRola
434 mun2
438 ESPN Deportes
439 Fox Sports en Espanol
440 GoITV
444 CNN en Espanol
445 Canal Sur
449 EWTN Espanol
500 iNDEMAND Previews
601-606 ESPN Game Plan / ESPN Full Court
650 NBA League Pass Preview
651-659 NBA League Pass / MLS Direct Kick
671-684 MLB Extra Innings / NHL Center Ice
840 Public Safety
850 Public Safety
851 Public Safety
853 Public Safety
854 Public Safety
856 Public Safety
857 Public Safety
DTV Elections. All Phoenix stations have made their final DTV elections for the channels they will use once the trasnsition is complete and analaog channels are turned off. Here is the new lineup:

Code:
 8  KAET  PBS
10  KSAZ  Fox
12  KPNX  NBC
15  KNXV  ABC
17  KPHO  CBS
20  KPAZ  TBN
24  KTVK  Independent
26  KUTP  MN
33  KTVW  Univision
39  KTAZ  Telemundo
49  KASW  CW
51  KPPX  ion
Points of Contact

KTVK-DT (IND 3/24) POC:
Jim Cole: jim_cole@azfamily.com (602-207-3369)
http://www.azfamily.com/customerservice/HelpCenter.do

KPHO-DT (CBS 5/17) POC:
General Manager: cbs5gm@news5.tv
Technical: cbs5eng@news5.tv
Seth Parker (Programming Director): Seth.Parker@kpho.com
Jon Thorwaldson (Engineering Supervisor): Jon.Thorwaldson@kpho.com
Ed Sutton?? (Head Engineer): esutton@mdp.com

KAET-DT (PBS 8/29) POC:
kaet@asu.edu
Greg Giczi: Greg.Giczi@asu.edu
Dennis Poe (Viewer Services): Dennis.Poe@asu.edu
Viewer Services: 480-965-2308
Reception Problems: 480-965-3506
Reception Problems (after hours): 480-965-0155
Digital: digieight@asu.edu

KSAZ-DT (FOX 10/31) POC:
Gerry Grunig: ggrun926@foxtv.com (602-262-5106)
Jim McDermaid: jmcde276@foxtv.com (602-262-5122)
Tom Lewis: tom.lewis@foxtv.com
Master Control: 602-262-5119/5128

KPNX-DT (NBC 12/36) POC:
http://www.azcentral.com/12news/contact/
Karl Voss: kvoss@kpnx.com (602-261-6148)

KNXV-DT (ABC 15/56) POC:
Ryan Stewart: rstewart@abc15.com
Programming - Programming@abc15.com
Engineering - engineering@abc15.com
Charles Whitlatch (Transmission Systems Engineer): cwhitlatch@abc15.com

KUTP-DT (MN 45/26) POC:
Gerry Grunig: ggrun926@foxtv.com (602-262-5106)
Jim McDermaid: jmcde276@foxtv.com (602-262-5122)
Tom Lewis: tom.lewis@foxtv.com
Master Control: 602-262-5119/5128
http://www.upn45phoenix.com/about/contact.shtml

KASW-DT (CW 61/49) POC:
Jim Cole: jim_cole@azfamily.com (602-207-3369)
http://www.quick6.com/
NOTE: If program is not in HD, try calling the main number (602-207-3333, press 1 to get to the newsroom, then ask to be transferred to engineering.

Answers: Phoenix AZ HDTV ( AVS Forum Local HDTV Info and Reception )
Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
Just stopping by...
Mat, Dave,
Is there a reason Mat is not just padding a scheduled recordinng from the guide instead of trying to set a manual recording? If you use the guide to select a show, you simply adjust the start time, as long as there in no conflict with other recordings, that should work.

vegggas
I've tried this as well recently and get the same problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ
If he records each separately, he can pad the beginning of the first and the end of the second, but oftentimes the first will end just before the end of the show and he has to catch that at the beginning of the second show, disrupting the flow I guess.
The reason why I do this is because CBS will start one show right as the previous was ending. With 2 recordings I sometimes miss the first 20 seconds of the 2nd show...a major pet peeve of mine.

Mat_M

Phoenix AZ HDTV

21.5dB SNR is awful for QAM. You really need at least 32 for reliable reception. A cut in the cable would allow in interference from FM radio (6 stations are broadcasting at 100kW in the frequency range used by 95) and destroy your SNR. You might consider trying another tuner to actually rule out problems with your existing tuners, rather than assuming that because one mode works another will.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mat_M
I've tried this as well recently and get the same problem.

The reason why I do this is because CBS will start one show right as the previous was ending. With 2 recordings I sometimes miss the first 20 seconds of the 2nd show...a major pet peeve of mine.
That's a pet peeve of mine as well and it happens on almost all channels. Anyway, I don't know what else to try other than a different box. I've heard of this problem before, but I can't remember where. It might have come up way back when cablecard units first came out and I don't remember the solution. Even though it's not supposed to, the manual recording seem to be working off the IPG times. Does this also happen when you pad a single program? I assume you've tried padding programs on other channels? Or padding a 2-hour movie? I don't remember, but did we try a "hard" reboot (where you press/hold the Power button while plugging the power back in)?

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynagen
Can somebody who has a contact within Cox ask if they're even putting out the QAM in my area? I feel more like i'm groping around for something that doesn't even freakin exist on the cable.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't think these are separate signals. These are the same signals everyone uses to view these channels. The only difference is that some, like me, are using a cable-provided tuner and others, like you, are using a separate QAM-capable tuner. The only way you shouldn't get them with a compatible tuner is if you were receiving them as part of your internet service where basic cable, including local channels via unencrypted QAM, used to be included. They no longer include basic cable as part of internet service and are turning those feeds off across the valley.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't think these are separate signals. These are the same signals everyone uses to view these channels. The only difference is that some, like me, are using a cable-provided tuner and others, like you, are using a separate QAM-capable tuner. The only way you shouldn't get them with a compatible tuner is if you were receiving them as part of your internet service where basic cable, including local channels via unencrypted QAM, used to be included. They no longer include basic cable as part of internet service and are turning those feeds off across the valley.
I'm subscribed to full digital service. I have 1 HD-DVR and 1 SD box. I get all the HD channels JUST FINE on the HD-DVR, it's been on 2 3.5db splits for a LONG time now with 0 issue. I actually need the splits because the signal coming in is too strong for the cable modem, the return signal is partially decimated. I had my apartment rewired with new cable from the distributer tap one door down cause my HD-DVR with no splits was sucking ass, then the signal was too much, so now the splits are necessary to drop the overall output on each split tap.

Ugh, I hate this **** just not working... Btw, the splitters at where the cable comes in, and the one in my room, are both 5-1000Mhz, so they're fine to carry the QAM. Also DoubleDAZ, I need to you clarify for me 100% here before I fly off the handle again about this. DO I NEED TO TWEAK THE QAM FREQUENCIES +1.75Mhz STILL? Cause 95 (91.25MHz) works WITHOUT tweaking... Which just leads me to believe, either the encryption is there messing with my tuner (not truly unencrypted QAM) or something's wrong and I'm not able to get these channels because of something that COX is doing. The hardware all suggests I'm fine minus the poor SNR, but I should STILL see some SNR on channels that should carry QAM unless there's some special encryption.

Cynagen

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Cynagen,

I assumed you had HD/digital cable service, but not having it is the only way I can see not getting the channels.

I am not versed enough in what you are doing or QAM tuning in general to answer your other question. All I know is plenty of other people are receiving the unencrypted QAM channels, so I know they are available. If you "tweak" the frequency and still don't get them, I just don't know what the problem could be, I wish I did. I can't think of anything Cox is intentionally doing, but there are always possiblities of some kind of incompatibilty and I don't know if there is anything unique about your area of Mesa.

I guess I understand the sport of blaming Cox for everything, but if other tuners are working, why would you think it's Cox, especially so vehemently? That doesn't mean it's not them, as it was with the CVCT stuff, but still, it just doesn't seem worth that much anger and frustration, but then I haven't spent the time and money trying to figure it out.

I wish I had an answer or could recommend another thread/site, but I can't. Hopefully, someone will see this and have some ideas. You seem to have done all you can. Maybe the hardware or software makers might have some ideas of what to look for. Surely they know what will make their stuff choke, even if it is something Cox is doing. I guess this is why cableco's don't actively support this stuff and why it's not even possible with sat. Sat takes the easy way out and says get our box. Cable tries to (or is forced to) work directly with TVs and they still get the bad press.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Cynagen,
Your poor SNR is the culprit, and probably caused by the PC power supply and PC circuitry adding too much noise. The channel 95 is a 64 QAM signal that has less headroom (only 1 HD channel instead of 2 HD's) or space, but is more tolerant to noise. According to your post of 21.5db, that is the MIIMUM for 64 QAM where the minimum for 256 QAM is about 28. That doesn't mean it will lock and display with that high of a noise floor, but that is about the minimu it will have any chance.
Go to the tips and tricks thread and check your STB diagnostics. There you can choose a local channel, check the diagnostics page to see the exact frequency it is tuned to, the Signal strength of that signal and the Signal to noise ratio of the QAM signal. FWIW, the 8300 will not lock onto a 256QAM signal below about 28DB and requires a SNR of about 32 to be considered good.
If you want a good non-technical example of Signal to Noise Ratio, consider this: Imagine you have a signal, such as a stereo system playing at average volume level. At the same level, in a quiet environment, it may seem loud and clear. Put that same system and volume level on an airport runway, and the surrounding noise is too great to hear it loud and clear. Now add a Jet taking off between you and the stereo, and you get an idea what happens to the signal (stereo) compared to the noise (jet). You may have the equivelent of a Jet in your PC adding noise that is masking the signal from the cable company.
You can use the tips and tricks thread diagnostics to find ALL of the various levels that are seen by the STB for each channel you get (Use a nown local channel, such as PBS as a test). If your card, in a PC, sees something different from the STB, It can only be attributted to the noise floor of the PC causing problems.

vegggas

vegggas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
I think I may have seen something like this viewing HD content, but my description is more like a checkerboard effect during panning or movement. Sections within a line are updated behind other sections, and the next line has alternating updates opposite the previous line. Think of all the red squares getting updated video, then the black squares are updated a second later.

vegggas
I know what you're talking about and I too can see the judder on 24p content broadcast at 1080i, but this is something different. It isn't related to interlacing because the problem doesn't show up on other 1080i channels. The early hockey game today on NBC did not exhibit the problem at all. However, during tonight's game on Versus when they showed highlights from the earlier NBC game, the problem showed up. It also occurred on the first round games that Versus took the CBC and TSN HD feeds for, so it's not an issue with the acquisition, but something either Versus or more likely Cox is doing to degrade the signal. I see similar effects on the other new channels, though those mainly appear as textures on the screen not moving when the object they are part of moves. For example, when there's a tight headshot and the person's pores are visible, if they nod or shake their head the pores stay put while the rest of the head moves. It's a really disturbing effect, so I try to sit further away from the screen when watching the new channels so the crappy quality is less noticeable.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

I'm not seeing that here, watching the same national feed. Is anyone else seeing what you are seeing and can chime in? How about a digicam photo to compare? We could record the same game and check the same time frame too.

edit: I'm recording WEC Wreckage right now...

vegggas

vegggas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynagen
I'm subscribed to full digital service. I have 1 HD-DVR and 1 SD box. I get all the HD channels JUST FINE on the HD-DVR, it's been on 2 3.5db splits for a LONG time now with 0 issue. I actually need the splits because the signal coming in is too strong for the cable modem, the return signal is partially decimated. I had my apartment rewired with new cable from the distributer tap one door down cause my HD-DVR with no splits was sucking ass, then the signal was too much, so now the splits are necessary to drop the overall output on each split tap.

Ugh, I hate this **** just not working... Btw, the splitters at where the cable comes in, and the one in my room, are both 5-1000Mhz, so they're fine to carry the QAM. Also DoubleDAZ, I need to you clarify for me 100% here before I fly off the handle again about this. DO I NEED TO TWEAK THE QAM FREQUENCIES +1.75Mhz STILL? Cause 95 (91.25MHz) works WITHOUT tweaking... Which just leads me to believe, either the encryption is there messing with my tuner (not truly unencrypted QAM) or something's wrong and I'm not able to get these channels because of something that COX is doing. The hardware all suggests I'm fine minus the poor SNR, but I should STILL see some SNR on channels that should carry QAM unless there's some special encryption.
There's no encryption on the clear channels, and even if there was, a correctly working tuner would still detect the transport stream and the various PIDs and programs it contained, it just wouldn't be able to decode them. You should be able to see a digital signal on almost every channel between 67 and 113 even though anything other than what's listed in the first post won't decode. If it can't, it's probably broken, even though it kinda sorta almost works for one channel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
Cynagen,
Your poor SNR is the culprit, and probably caused by the PC power supply and PC circuitry adding too much noise. The channel 95 is a 64 QAM signal that has less headroom (only 1 HD channel instead of 2 HD's) or space, but is more tolerant to noise. According to your post of 21.5db, that is the MIIMUM for 64 QAM where the minimum for 256 QAM is about 28. That doesn't mean it will lock and display with that high of a noise floor, but that is about the minimu it will have any chance.
Go to the tips and tricks thread and check your STB diagnostics. There you can choose a local channel, check the diagnostics page to see the exact frequency it is tuned to, the Signal strength of that signal and the Signal to noise ratio of the QAM signal. FWIW, the 8300 will not lock onto a 256QAM signal below about 28DB and requires a SNR of about 32 to be considered good.
If you want a good non-technical example of Signal to Noise Ratio, consider this: Imagine you have a signal, such as a stereo system playing at average volume level. At the same level, in a quiet environment, it may seem loud and clear. Put that same system and volume level on an airport runway, and the surrounding noise is too great to hear it loud and clear. Now add a Jet taking off between you and the stereo, and you get an idea what happens to the signal (stereo) compared to the noise (jet). You may have the equivelent of a Jet in your PC adding noise that is masking the signal from the cable company.
You can use the tips and tricks thread diagnostics to find ALL of the various levels that are seen by the STB for each channel you get (Use a nown local channel, such as PBS as a test). If your card, in a PC, sees something different from the STB, It can only be attributted to the noise floor of the PC causing problems.

vegggas
I'd lean toward a half-broken tuner before blaming a lousy PC for the problems. I've successfully used PCI tuners in computers that were so electrically noisy that you could hear hard drive activity as clicking noises on the speakers, and could gauge CPU usage by the pitch of the hum it added to the sound. The amount of RF noise a PC would have to generate to disrupt a digital tuner to the level seen here would add all kinds of nastiness to the video output and would be clearly noticeable to anyone looking at the screen.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
I'm not seeing that here, watching the same national feed. Is anyone else seeing what you are seeing and can chime in? How about a digicam photo to compare? We could record the same game and check the same time frame too.

edit: I'm recording WEC Wreckage right now...

vegggas
No DVR, and every HD channel is flagged copy-once so I can't record over Firewire. My friends in the digital age looking out for my rights, no doubt.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ
Hopefully, someone will see this and have some ideas.
Glad to see vegggas and coyoteaz chime in here and reiterate the S/N problem with some more detailed explanation.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mat_M
... CBS will start one show right as the previous was ending. With 2 recordings I sometimes miss the first 20 seconds of the 2nd show...a major pet peeve of mine.
I think you might be preachin' to the choir, but it gives me an opportunity to tell you all about an unpublished feature of the HR2x platform used by DirecTV. In comparisons to the HR10-250, at least, and every one of the other dozen or so PVRs I have owned, it seems to either not suffer from this problem or at least not as much.

For instance if I record the CBS comedy block on Mondays, there is normally just a second or so missing between shows, and sometimes they even overlap (!) for a few seconds (same video at the end of one as at the beginning of the next). Tivo regularly truncates a good 5-10 seconds between adjacent seamless-transition shows, which I hate.

This is not formal padding on the HR2x, it just seems to happen naturally, and I think it even happens when the other tuner is busy.

Not sure how they do it, or whether it is by design. Just happy it works.

TomCat

Phoenix AZ HDTV

How many times do I have to iterate it? My lines are perfect, so it's either the card (not likely) or a COX issue...

Here's from channel 710:
CURRENT QAM
Freq: 537.000MHz
Tuning Mode: QAM-256
Status: Locked
Level: 5 dBmV
S/N: 35-37dB
Seconds: 10000+
Corr Bytes: 0
Uncor Blks: 0
Errs Avg/Inst: 0 / 0
EQ Gain: 1.000000

Yeah... Like I said, it's not likely the card since I can tune Leased Access, and the QAM is all put through the same chip. My lines are perfect and without the splits, I get too much signal.

Here's my splits:
DMARK direct to 2-way 3.5db splitter:
Split 1 to another 2-way 3.5db split, feeds my DVR/Sony LocationFree.
Split 2 to 25ft extension into my bedroom and 3-way split

Split 2 to 3-way Splitter:
3.5db -> Digital Tuner connection
7.0db -> Cable modem
7.0db -> Analog Tuner connection

Cynagen

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynagen
How many times do I have to iterate it? My lines are perfect, so it's either the card (not likely) or a COX issue...

Here's from channel 710:
CURRENT QAM
Freq: 537.000MHz
Tuning Mode: QAM-256
Status: Locked
Level: 5 dBmV
S/N: 35-37dB
Seconds: 10000+
Corr Bytes: 0
Uncor Blks: 0

Errs Avg/Inst: 0 / 0
EQ Gain: 1.000000

Yeah... Like I said, it's not likely the card since I can tune Leased Access, and the QAM is all put through the same chip. My lines are perfect and without the splits, I get too much signal.

Here's my splits:
DMARK direct to 2-way 3.5db splitter:
Split 1 to another 2-way 3.5db split, feeds my DVR/Sony LocationFree.
Split 2 to 25ft extension into my bedroom and 3-way split

Split 2 to 3-way Splitter:
3.5db -> Digital Tuner connection
7.0db -> Cable modem
7.0db -> Analog Tuner connection
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynagen
I upgraded to newer drivers, 4.2 CD, and i got a Digital Signal Quality checker. I'm reading ~21.5db SNR for channel 95, lots of uncorrectable errors. I think just the cable in my apartment is bad at this point. My cable modem works fine on the same splitter, no issues, but I know that can frequency hop. I was hoping at least a few channels would come in.
First, that is the standard channel assignment for digital cable RF channel 76 with the center frequency as 537MHz.
I highlighted the important stuff in your previous posts. The STB is seeing a perfectly good signal with SNR of 35-37db, but your "Digital Signal Quality checker" is showing ~21.5db with "lots of uncorrectable errors". There is no way you will be able to lock onto a signal with a SNR that low on that device. There is something seriously wrong with your tuner card or the PC is creating noise that is driving that SNR down to unusable levels. There is nothing Cox is doing that is preventing you from seeing those signals (as proved by your STB diagnostices & many would absolutely kill for those kinds of levels). A standard QAM TV tuner or TivoHD or any standalone QAM tuner would be picking up all of those channels with no problems at all. The problem exists within the card/PC area only.

Now, you could compare your "Leased Channel 95" or whatever that channels is between what the card sees and what the STB sees. That should be interesting. If you wanted to try a simple test, you could go pick up a USB QAM tuner at Fry's or someplace similar (for a return if needed) and easily scan all of the unencrypted channels, proving that your PC Card setup is bad. I picked one up for about $60 and take it with me as I travel and have never had an issue with unencrypted QAM channels anywhere - and I travel a lot!

vegggas

vegggas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
I'm not seeing that here, watching the same national feed. Is anyone else seeing what you are seeing and can chime in? How about a digicam photo to compare? We could record the same game and check the same time frame too.

edit: I'm recording WEC Wreckage right now...

vegggas
Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteaz
No DVR, and every HD channel is flagged copy-once so I can't record over Firewire. My friends in the digital age looking out for my rights, no doubt.
I watched the WEC WrekCage fights on VS in HD - not a single noted video problem.
I will record the Canadiens at Flyers game tomorrow afternoon as the next HD feed .
Edit - and the Hockey Central program immediately following - make note of particulary bad parts on either program and I will check my recording.

vegggas

vegggas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
First, that is the standard channel assignment for digital cable RF channel 76 with the center frequency as 537MHz.
I highlighted the important stuff in your previous posts. The STB is seeing a perfectly good signal with SNR of 35-37db, but your "Digital Signal Quality checker" is showing ~21.5db with "lots of uncorrectable errors". There is no way you will be able to lock onto a signal with a SNR that low on that device. There is something seriously wrong with your tuner card or the PC is creating noise that is driving that SNR down to unusable levels. There is nothing Cox is doing that is preventing you from seeing those signals (as proved by your STB diagnostices & many would absolutely kill for those kinds of levels). A standard QAM TV tuner or TivoHD or any standalone QAM tuner would be picking up all of those channels with no problems at all. The problem exists within the card/PC area only.

Now, you could compare your "Leased Channel 95" or whatever that channels is between what the card sees and what the STB sees. That should be interesting. If you wanted to try a simple test, you could go pick up a USB QAM tuner at Fry's or someplace similar (for a return if needed) and easily scan all of the unencrypted channels, proving that your PC Card setup is bad. I picked one up for about $60 and take it with me as I travel and have never had an issue with unencrypted QAM channels anywhere - and I travel a lot!

vegggas
Ugh, I can't spend anymore money on this endeavor... I've already sunk too much. And I got friends beating down my door for money I owe, so that kinda tightens the noose a bit here... Maybe if I get my tax rebate this week I'll be able to. I unno... But yes, fine, i'll break down and buy something to test with, and i'll be giving Hauppauge another call to arrange an RMA. I don't like USB, I prefer a PCI-Express, lots of room and no chance my cat will get playful and i'll find I don't have cable in the morning.

And if anyone wants my signal levels, the apartment is full utils paid with rent, $640ish with the rent hike, I don't particularly wanna be here anymore anyways. I'd rather be someplace I can tear up the walls all I want to lay down my own cable. You should see the effin copper in the wall for the phones... complete nightmare.

Cynagen

Phoenix AZ HDTV

I don't recommend the USB for a permanent install - They get hot and are finicky. I only suggest it as a temporary measure to test your setup. If you find a place with a liberal return policy, it's worth a shot see what happens. There is still a chance that the PC is causing the noise issue and that a USB tuner could still be effected. What everyone has told you is that there is nothng wrong with the signals from cox and that the problems are either in your hardware or within your PC setup.
You haven't yet told us why the big difference in Signal to Noise Ratio between your equipment and the Cox STB.

vegggas

vegggas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
I don't recommend the USB for a permanent install - They get hot and are finicky. I only suggest it as a temporary measure to test your setup. If you find a place with a liberal return policy, it's worth a shot see what happens. There is still a chance that the PC is causing the noise issue and that a USB tuner could still be effected. What everyone has told you is that there is nothng wrong with the signals from cox and that the problems are either in your hardware or within your PC setup.
You haven't yet told us why the big difference in Signal to Noise Ratio between your equipment and the Cox STB.

vegggas
I don't know why either... they're both on 7.0db stepdowns, and even only the 3.5 on the 3-way with the 25foot to the entry point, it still never works. I dunno. And like somebody else said in here earlier... the PC noise would have to be immense to effect the tuner that bad, and I have very little to none, or good audio/video cards/devices which filter it all out very well... Not likely that it's a shielding problem inside the computer, however I wouldn't put it past a shorting coax connection. (On the tuner that is)

Cynagen

Phoenix AZ HDTV

vegggas,

FWIW, Channel 95 is Go AZ.TV (15.2), a 2nd ABC-15 sub-channel. My 8300HD numbers for that channel are Freq - 687.000 Mhz, Mode - QAM-256, Level - 2 dBmV, S/N - 36dB, Corr Bytes - 0 and Uncor Blks - 0.

BTW. You must be between trips. It's been awhile since you've been able to participate this much.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ
vegggas,
BTW. You must be between trips. It's been awhile since you've been able to participate this much.
I'm back for a while
vegggas

vegggas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Physical channel 95 contains a 64QAM digital version of analog 96 and about 23Mbit/s worth of nullpackets last I checked. I suspect Cynagen is referring to that, not the channel remapped to 95 on a box which is really 106.3.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteaz
Physical channel 95 contains a 64QAM digital version of analog 96 and about 23Mbit/s worth of nullpackets last I checked. I suspect Cynagen is referring to that, not the channel remapped to 95 on a box which is really 106.3.
You're undoubtedly right, sorry about that.

So, if I read the chart on the first post right, does that then equate to Cox Channel 22, Leased Channel? If it does, my box shows QAM-256, 0 dBmV, 36 dB, 0 and 0 for that channel.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ
You're undoubtedly right, sorry about that.

So, if I read the chart on the first post right, does that then equate to Cox Channel 22, Leased Channel? If it does, my box shows QAM-256, 0 dBmV, 36 dB, 0 and 0 for that channel.
That it is, and your box is getting a QAM-256 version? How the hell? Last I checked mine on the cable box, it was QAM-64 and coming through at 35db for me...

@coyoteaz: I actually get a channel out of that... picture and sound, not null here.

Cynagen

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Hi Everyone,
I am new here and I hope I post this in the right thread.

I just got Sony KDL-52XBR4 for my living room.
I attached the cable (basic cable) to the TV and then do an auto scan for the channels.
The result shows 24 Analog and 28 Digital Channels.
However I think those 28 digital channels are not really HD.
The TV information shows all these channels as 480i SD. The digital channels range from 35.x to 95.1 and none of them broadcast HD.
I have a Magnavox 32MF337B in the bedroom and that one can pull in HD channels between 0.7xx - 0.8xx (Fox, NBC, PBS, etc, all HD).
I can't make the KDL-523XBR4 to tune into the 0.7xx channels. I can enter the number directly but the tv would say no signal detected.

Anyone know why I can't get 0.7xx HD channels with the Sony KDL-52XBR4 ?

Thank you for any help.

Bochie

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynagen
That it is, and your box is getting a QAM-256 version? How the hell? Last I checked mine on the cable box, it was QAM-64 and coming through at 35db for me...
Well, that's weird. When I check now, it shows 93.000 Mhz, QAM-64, 6 dBmV, 37 dB, 0 and 0, which all sounds more correct. Maybe I didn't let it sit long enough to update last night, though it updates in the usual second or so this morning and I let it sit for a minute or more last night. Anyway, those should be good numbers now.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynagen
That it is, and your box is getting a QAM-256 version? How the hell? Last I checked mine on the cable box, it was QAM-64 and coming through at 35db for me...

@coyoteaz: I actually get a channel out of that... picture and sound, not null here.
If one checks the channel with a QAM tuner there is 1 program for the digital simulcast of 22 (not 96 as I previously stated--when I was making the lineup prior to this last round of channel swaps, both 22 and 96 analog were showing the same HSN feed so I mixed them up) with nullpackets using up the rest of the 27Mbit/s available on a 64QAM channel.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Channel 1 here near 35th Avenue and the 101 is now a On Demand preview channel with a coming soon in the upper righ hand corner.

buster1022

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by buster1022
Channel 1 here near 35th Avenue and the 101 is now a On Demand preview channel with a coming soon in the upper righ hand corner.
nothing new here in Mesa

HairyBee

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Any suggestions how to get my Series3 HD TiVo (with dual CableCARDs) to recognize that there *is* a Channel 734 now? I can't even tune to it - "Channel not available."

Grrrr...

--John

P.S. I've already tried scanning for channels (which only seems to scan OTA, anyway), and forcing a TiVo daily "call" (via Internet) - no dice.

UPDATE: Finally tried completely rebooting the TiVo, which apparently forced it to grab the latest channel lineup via CableCARD - I still don't have guide data for it yet, but at least I have Channel 734! Woohoo!

John Bennett

Phoenix AZ HDTV

I have it and I don't sub to the S/I tier.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Cox HD channels are equivalent to their SD version for tiering purposes. Vs/Golf HD is part of the sports tier since Versus is, and FSN HD is part of standard since FSN is.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Did you happen to capture any bitrate info from last night's HD broadcast?

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Thanks, all. I had to reboot yesterday to get 734 so now all is well. A Tivo HD with twin buffering capability let me watch both the Suns and the DBacks tonight, missing nothing.

jebbbz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by theratpatrol
Yes D* will be showing all the games in HD. If you have one of the newer MPEG4 receivers the games will be on channel 649-1. Make sure that channel is added to your custom channel list if you have one set up.
D* has some major syncing problems on 649.1. The sound is about 4 seconds behind the picture.

2weeks

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Man, the Idol special last night was almost unwatchable. Had knots in my stomach during 5 minute durations of the picture freezing. So frustrating! Unplugged my box several times, didn't help. Time to go back to DirecTV.

Rob9874

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob9874
Man, the Idol special last night was almost unwatchable. Had knots in my stomach during 5 minute durations of the picture freezing. So frustrating! Unplugged my box several times, didn't help. Time to go back to DirecTV.
If your talking about cox, I do know they have been doing somethings to the network lately. I had issues about a week and a half ago, but they notified me ahead of time and I was please that though it lasted two days, it went away. Have you called to try and get to the root of the issue... how bout having a tech out for service?

jdastas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Cox doesn't do maintenance during primetime, and they certainly don't do it during the highest rated show on TV. Most maintenance is done after midnight, with some stuff during business hours.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Big changes coming to Cox LV's lineup this summer which might bring some good news if it makes it down here in a reasonable timeframe:
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas
This is the start of a major realignment and change of the lineup
From Cox
http://www.cox.com/lasvegas/whatsnew.asp
Quote:
Hi Def LINE UP CHANGE EFFECTIVE JUNE 1, 2008

In order to make room for more and more FREE HD channels, Cox is re-structuring the current HD line-up, currently on channels 700-735.

IMPORTANT: If you schedule Hi Def DVR recordings on channels 700-735, please print this line up and use when scheduling any HD recordings starting June 1, 2008
See the new lineup[link = http://www.cox.com/lasvegas/channelchanges.asp ]
http://www.cox.com/lasvegas/channelchanges.asp
701 HD PPV
703 NBC HD
705 Fox HD
706 The CW
707 TBS HD
708 CBS HD
710 PBS HD
713 ABC HD
718 TNT HD
725 Discovery Channel HD
730 ESPN HD
731 ESPN2 HD
732 A&E HD
733 TLC HD
734 USA Network HD
742 Food Network HD
743 History Channel HD
745 SciFi HD
755 HGTV HD
758 Animal Planet HD
766 Travel Channel HD
768 National Geographic HD
769 The Science Channel HD
770 Discovery HD Theatre
791 MHD
792 Universal HD
793 Mojo
800 HBO
810 Cinemax
820 Showtime
830 Starz

vegggas
Definitely a couple in there we've been waiting for like USA, SciFi, and Travel, but still no FX .

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteaz
Big changes coming to Cox LV's lineup this summer which might bring some good news if it makes it down here in a reasonable timeframe:

Definitely a couple in there we've been waiting for like USA, SciFi, and Travel, but still no FX .
But will these changes effect us? I don't see anything that says Phoenix.

jdastas

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdastas
But will these changes effect us? I don't see anything that says Phoenix.
I think his point is that at least now we know Cox has agreements with those additional channels and that is a good indicator that they should be added at some point. Cox has stated that offerings will be standardized across all markets, so it's just a matter of time. Since the VOD roll-out won't be completed until June or so, I don't expect to see more until then, but that's just my opinion.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

The changes LV is doing seem to be right on. Phoenix had this type of lineup (7+channel number in most cases...though the movie channels, NGC, Science Channel HD, and HD Theater have special numbers) since launch and for a long time after.

Tracker[HD]

Phoenix AZ HDTV

I'm using a Toshiba Regza with Qam tuner.
I have Cox digital cable (without the set-top box).

I cannot seem to get the TV to scan and find the CBS (kpho) afilliate in high definition.
All my other locals are showing up just fine.

I'm guessing I need to add the channel manually.

Can someone please tell me the steps I need to take to add this channel?

Thanks.

Marc

ArcMay

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcMay
I'm using a Toshiba Regza with Qam tuner.
I have Cox digital cable (without the set-top box).

I cannot seem to get the TV to scan and find the CBS (kpho) afilliate in high definition.
All my other locals are showing up just fine.

I'm guessing I need to add the channel manually.

Can someone please tell me the steps I need to take to add this channel?

Thanks.

Marc
About the time the NCAA Tournament started last month I lost CBS 5 in HD on 106-2 using the QAM. It just disappeared. All my other local HD channels still work. I have a Panasonic Plasma.

24601

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24601
About the time the NCAA Tournament started last month I lost CBS 5 in HD on 106-2 using the QAM. It just disappeared. All my other local HD channels still work. I have a Panasonic Plasma.
Did you try a rescan? KPHO converts from 1HD/1SD to 3SD for the first round, then back for later rounds. They should now be back to 1HD/1SD or whatever their current standard is.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ
Did you try a rescan? KPHO converts from 1HD/1SD to 3SD for the first round, then back for later rounds. They should now be back to 1HD/1SD or whatever their current standard is.
I've tried a couple of rescans per week since I lost 106-2 but with no luck. It still tunes in 5-3 which was added for the tournament but is now just a blank screen. It's too bad because CBS is one of my favorite networks.

24601

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Same on my TVs that use QAM - no CBS HD, but I can get 5-3. Also Channel 3 comes in as 1-703 for me now.

walkabt

Phoenix AZ HDTV

0.705 is missing from the CVCT. I'll send an email.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteaz
0.705 is missing from the CVCT. I'll send an email.
You beat me to it, I was just going to suggest that might be the problem. See? I can learn about this stuff.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

In regards to the CBS .705 issue, could you please send me an email too?

Thanks.

ArcMay

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcMay
In regards to the CBS .705 issue, could you please send me an email too?

Thanks.
I'm pretty sure he means he'll send an email to Cox/KPHO to get the CVCT fixed so the channel will show up on a rescan. He went through this with them some time ago and finally got it fixed. Let's hope it doesn't take that long this time. Of course, now we pretty much know what the problem is and who's responsible, so things should be easier. Then, it will probably happen next year when KPHO goes to 3 SD for March Madness again.

Keep checking here or do a rescan every so often to see when it gets fixed.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

What Dave said. I find it odd that 0.705 dropped out of the CVCT while 0.86 is still around and pointing to a program with PIDs that don't exist (basically, the container is there and it has a label on it, but there's nothing in it).

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

They sent a hit out to all the boxes here apparently - they turned off all overnight without any action from us.

Kyrene and Ray

Tracker[HD]

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteaz
What Dave said. I find it odd that 0.705 dropped out of the CVCT while 0.86 is still around and pointing to a program with PIDs that don't exist (basically, the container is there and it has a label on it, but there's nothing in it).
Is this something that someone (myself?) should contact KPHO about, or will they resolve this on their own?

Thank you for your reply. I'd really like to get CBS going again in high def!

Marc

ArcMay

Phoenix AZ HDTV

KPHO will more than likely have no idea what you're talking about. One of the other local station's engineers helped us get Cox to fix their data before, and I've already emailed him and asked him to send something over to his contact at Cox to get it fixed.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Anybody else see this error during The Office last night on 712? It was only displayed for a fraction of a second, preceded by bad pixelation.

Evil Red Background:
Signal Loss Detected
Service ID 3
(3255)

Is that an SA8300HD error on my end, or the signal received by Cox? Before and after this event, the PIQ was great.

thechad6

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by thechad6
Anybody else see this error during The Office last night on 712? It was only displayed for a fraction of a second, preceded by bad pixelation.

Evil Red Background:
Signal Loss Detected
Service ID 3
(3255)

Is that an SA8300HD error on my end, or the signal received by Cox? Before and after this event, the PIQ was great.
I saw it too. I've been having bad pixelation problems lately, and was tempted to try to exchange my box. But I feel better knowing others are experiencing it too. Now I know it's not just me. Yes, I saw the Evil Red Screen too.

Rob9874

Phoenix AZ HDTV

My guess is there was a storm in NY over the NBC uplink, I saw it OTA

kb7oeb

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Plus, before you go changing out boxes, make sure they aren't just working in your area. They are upgrading the whole system, again, and problems could be experienced for a couple of weeks or so as they move from one area to another.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomCat
2. The fact that prime time starts at 7 PM for the Central and Mountain time zones, and at 8 PM for the Eastern and Pacific zones. That is a second thing, that does not change, and is based on Eastern and Pacific having a legacy viewership that is more urban and accustomed to later hours, and Central and Mountain having a legacy viewership that is more rural and agriculturally-oriented, and accustomed to earlier hours for prime TV viewing time.
Thanks for that bit of info. For the life of me I could never understand the logic why programming starts at 7:00 here. Given your explanation, I still don't understand why, but I guess I understand the lack of reasoning behind the decision. After all, the majority of us here in AZ are AG based, aren't we.

Wolffpack

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomCat
From now on, I would appreciate it if you refrain from quoting me out of context, and then tacking on a smart-ass comment that makes it look like I said something completely different than what I actually said.
What you said was that the Pacific feed was in sync with Arizona during the summer months, which is just not true. Why don't you admit that you were wrong (just this once), skip the profanity, and move on?

pbenjamin

Phoenix AZ HDTV

As has been mentioned here, Fox has separate HD feeds for each unique timezone, though I'm not sure about Hawaii, and Anchorage's Fox station is still not doing HD AFAIK. ABC, CBS, NBC, and CW have 2 feeds, for Eastern/Central and Pacific. The affiliates of those networks in other timezones delay the HD feed and play it out for us. With the exception of Jeopardy and Wheel, all HD is fed at the time it is scheduled to air in that timezone. There are some pre-feeds for certain shows airing on Canadian networks, but those don't officially exist.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolffpack
Thanks for that bit of info. For the life of me I could never understand the logic why programming starts at 7:00 here. Given your explanation, I still don't understand why, but I guess I understand the lack of reasoning behind the decision. After all, the majority of us here in AZ are AG based, aren't we.
Spoken like a true city-slicker or Easterner.

Actually, there is very little practical reason for it today other than the fact that is what folks in the Central and Mountain timezones have become used to over the years. I don't know what time you get up in the AM, but getting up at 5:00 is a bit easier if I can go to bed around 10:00 and still catch all of Primetime. Of course, timeshifting DVRs now make that a non-issue too these days, but old habits die hard.

In the old days, the majority of Central and Mountain folks were farmers and plowing, milking, etc., drove the priorities of the day and that always started before sunrise. Farm animals tend to live on nature's time and plowing used to make for very long days. If the networks wanted those folks, who were in the majority back then, as veiwers, they simply had to adjust primetime to allow for the farming lifestyle. Those are the same reasons we have DST, though AZ has more than it's share of sunshine and heat, so they've opted out of DST.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

I've always assumed that the reason the Central time zone had a 7-10 primetime had more to do with the fact that they could see the same programming as the Eastern time zone without recording, delay, etc., than it did with lifestyles associated with these regions. It is possible that the lifestyle made the earlier times more acceptable, but I am not sure it was the primary reason.

I am less clear on why the Mountain time zone is the way it is. I wonder if a glimpse at the Phoenix TV listings for the early 50's would show a primetime TWO hours earlier than the East Coast? I have a dim recollection from years back of watching Johnny Carson at 9:30 in a motel in New Mexico. I guess it was possible that it was on cable from Texas, though.

And of course these references to primetime are a bit skewed in that it was three and a half hours until the early 70s when the FCC, in hopes of encouraging local programming, took the period 7:30-8:00 ET away from the networks. History shows that that timeslot was ultimately consumed with syndicated programming, game shows, etc., but the change stuck and Monday-Saturday primetime has been 3 hours ever since.

pbenjamin

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Mountain timezone states are/were filled with agriculture and ranching, all susceptable to early morning "chores". However, your theory has some merit, at least so far as Eastern and Central zones, but I'd say it was the other way around, Eastern became 8-11 so that Central could be 7-10.

The theory totally falls apart though with regard to Mountain and Pacific zones.

BTW, I grew up in the Central zone beginning back in '47 and this is the way I always remember things, though I'll admit I didn't pay too much attention to that kind of stuff back then and I really don't today either.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Has anyone gotten the new D* HR20 HD DVR installed in the area? If so:

- What kind of D* deals did you get them for? Please note what you upgraded from since that can affect the deal.
- How has it been operating? Some audio issues have been reported.

I know there are nationwide forums on both issues, but its hard to tell whether the deals and issues are specific to a particular area.

Relatedly, has anyone gotten the new 30" International Dish, and how's that been going? I almost got one installed, but decided to wait to install it and the HR20/5 LNB dish at the same time.

randall

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Last Sunday, D* installed two HR20's, and the 5-LNB dish. I had/have the HR10, of which I received all the OTA HD channels in Surprise. I am currently living in Tucson, and am receiving all four of the local HD content, including most/all of the analog stations.

My deal was $99 for the first HR20, and the second HR20 was free, if I exchanged my HR10, but the installer forgot to take the HR10, so I may use it, however, I don't have a third HD TV, so I don't know.

I paid the installer $100 for the install, and that was an agreement with D*, so I would not have a 2-year contract, otherwise, the install would have been free. I had to go through Customer Retention to get this deal. I also am to receive a $100 credit on my bill, time will tell on that one.

I have not had any bad experiences with this setup, and no audio problems, but again time will tell. I saw a little pixelation on the Nascar show, but only sporadically. So far, I believe this HR20 is better than the Tivo HR10, but that is MHO.

sytyguy

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Here are a couple of discussions on the subject of why the middle of the country has earlier primetime, supporting parts of both theories:

http://archives.stupidquestion.net/sq12899tv.html

http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_362b.html

pbenjamin

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by randall
Has anyone gotten the new D* HR20 HD DVR installed in the area?
I was recently a 10 yr D* "A-list" customer, for whatever that's worth. I called 2 weeks ago to upgrade my standard Tivo to the HR20 and finally put my 4 yr old HDTV to good use. On my first call they told me it was $299 to lease the hardware and install the 5LNB dish. I said "that sucks, but let me think about it." I called the next day and they told me they were out of stock but I could lease them from Best Buy for $399. I said "wow, this deal is getting better and better...you mean i have to put up with BB's horrible customer service just to get hardware I will not own, AND pay $100 more?"

I told them looks like you lost me as a customer....I'll call back to cancel service as soon as my new Cox HD service is installed. They basically told me "see ya, dont let the door hit you in the a**!" So I had cox installed for free, no upfront hardware costs, and I'm saving $20 a month with their bundle....and I have HD for less than regular D*!

Finally, I called D* to cancel service and was offered bigger and bigger discounts to stay until the final offer of $50 to install and upgrade was made. But they couldnt guarantee that I'd get the HR20, I could get the HR10. No, thanks. I learned a long time ago to never pay to lease D* hardware. In 2 months they'll probably give them away with a free Hawaiian vacation.

I'm happy with my Cox HD and $240 net yearly savings for now. If D* ever gets those 150 HD channels they keep talking about, I may come back. But then again, all I keep reading about is how crappy their HD-Lite is. I'd love to somehow compare the PQ side by side between Cox HD and D* HD-Lite on my ancient CRT 1080i HDTV.

Anyone here have both services? How do HD Locals look on D*?

azdevil

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Hi all,
I searched through this thread and it seems that a few months ago some people reported problems recording HD content from their Cox STBs.

I am trying to record from my SA3250 and having trouble, so I thought I'd ask:

Is anyone currently able to record via the Firewire port on their Cox STB?

Thanks,
Tim

othy

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by azdevil
Finally, I called D* to cancel service and was offered bigger and bigger discounts to stay until the final offer of $50 to install and upgrade was made. But they couldnt guarantee that I'd get the HR20, I could get the HR10. No, thanks. I learned a long time ago to never pay to lease D* hardware. In 2 months they'll probably give them away with a free Hawaiian vacation.

I'm happy with my Cox HD and $240 net yearly savings for now. If D* ever gets those 150 HD channels they keep talking about, I may come back. But then again, all I keep reading about is how crappy their HD-Lite is. I'd love to somehow compare the PQ side by side between Cox HD and D* HD-Lite on my ancient CRT 1080i HDTV.

Anyone here have both services? How do HD Locals look on D*?
You should have gone to Customer Retention right from the beginning, that's what I did, and I received two HR20's, and the 5-LNB for $99, and credit of $100. It did cost me $100 for the installation, but I could have gotten that free if I signed a 2-year contract. I think the PQ is very good, and the HR20 seems to work flawlessly, so far.

I used to have both Cox HD, and D* at the same time, and I thought the PQ was very good with both.

This link is what convinced me to go the HR20 route, http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=61865

Oh, and the fact that I was moving to Tucson, and knew I would not be receiving local HD from either OTA or cable.

sytyguy

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by othy
Hi all,
I searched through this thread and it seems that a few months ago some people reported problems recording HD content from their Cox STBs.

I am trying to record from my SA3250 and having trouble, so I thought I'd ask:

Is anyone currently able to record via the Firewire port on their Cox STB?

Thanks,
Tim
You need a firmware update to get it working, but you will likely be disappointed by the copy protection. Search this thread for firmware and you'll find the post with instructions.

Shink

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by othy
Hi all,
I searched through this thread and it seems that a few months ago some people reported problems recording HD content from their Cox STBs.

I am trying to record from my SA3250 and having trouble, so I thought I'd ask:

Is anyone currently able to record via the Firewire port on their Cox STB?

Thanks,
Tim
What channels are you trying to record and what type of PC/software are you using?

MickeyDora

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by azdevil
I told them looks like you lost me as a customer....I'll call back to cancel service as soon as my new Cox HD service is installed. They basically told me "see ya, dont let the door hit you in the a**!" So I had cox installed for free, no upfront hardware costs, and I'm saving $20 a month with their bundle....and I have HD for less than regular D*!?
I find it hard to believe they told you that in so many words. You term of "basically" pretty much lays that out. But as sytyguy states, calling DTV's customer retention would have been a better start. Looking at any of the "how to get a deal" thread on dbstalk.com could have also helped you secure a better deal.

But if in the end you're happy with Cox and the deal they gave you, good for you. At least with Cox you can always cancel and try something else without the 2 year committment DTV try's to get you into.

Wolffpack

Phoenix AZ HDTV

This one belongs to the fans
Thom Brennaman joining dad in Reds radio booth


BY JOHN FAY AND JOHN ERARDI CINCINNATI ENQUIRER STAFF WRITERS

For Thom Brennaman, the decision on whether to leave Phoenix and return to the Cincinnati Reds' radio and television booth was influenced by family.

But the deciding factor wasn't the opportunity to work with his father, Marty Brennaman.

Rather, it came down to Thom's wife and two children.

And as the 43-year-old mulled over the best place to raise his family, he realized everything that the Queen City has to offer.

Once Thom's wife, Polly, who is a Phoenix native, gave the OK, he quickly reached a deal with the Reds.

"To live in a neighborhood, where there aren't walls around houses or gates to get in a neighborhood: Those things are priceless," Thom said Wednesday afternoon after being formally introduced as the newest member of the Reds broadcasting crew.

He has a four-year contract, through the 2010 season.

In hiring Thom, who spent the past nine seasons with the Arizona Diamondbacks, the Reds organization put to rest weeks of speculation about the successor to Steve Stewart.

Stewart's contract was not renewed after three seasons in the radio booth.

Thom's hiring also helps establish a line of succession to Marty Brennaman, the Hall of Fame announcer who says he wants to stop working full time after four more seasons as the Reds' play-by-play announcer. Marty is 64.

Thom has national obligations that include calling NFL and baseball games for Fox. As a result, he'll split his time evenly between radio and television and do about 90 games total for the Reds.

That means the team will have to hire another person to fill in for Thom.

Even though Thom's time with the team is somewhat limited, Reds chief executive officer Bob Castellini said the decision to hire him was a "no-brainer."

The process began in late August, when the Reds asked and received permission from the Diamondbacks to talk with Thom.

"I can't thank them enough," Thom said of his former team. "They could have said no."

Thom visited Cincinnati a couple of times during the wooing process.

"It wasn't the easiest thing to get him from Phoenix," Castellini said.

Thom and Polly are leaving two in-laws in Phoenix. But they'll gain family here. And while Thom said working with his father wasn't the driving force behind his decision to return, that chance is sweet.

"I didn't think this day would ever come," Marty Brennaman said. "If it wasn't for (Castellini) and his perseverance and (Reds chief operating officer) John Allen's leg work, this day would have never come. Quite honestly, I didn't think it would come."

Neither did Thom.

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.d...50342/1062/SPT

fredfa

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
So I had cox installed for free, no upfront hardware costs, and I'm saving $20 a month with their bundle....and I have HD for less than regular D*!
<sarcasm>
Seems you've discovered our secret. Now you'll probably want to come to the weekly parties we have. We all sit around praising Cox and drinking Koolaid (Oh Yeah!).
And their customer service is sooo much better then the others. Cox's CSRs are as smart as they can be.
</sarcasm>

2weeks

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Yeah, the cox csr I got was very knowledgable actually, now that you mention it. It was nice not to have to get out my pakistani dictionary to communicate with them like i did with directv. But I'm sure I just got lucky and in a few years every call to every CSR for every business in "America" will require one of those.

azdevil

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by azdevil
Yeah, the cox csr I got was very knowledgable actually, now that you mention it. It was nice not to have to get out my pakistani dictionary to communicate with them like i did with directv. But I'm sure I just got lucky and in a few years every call to every CSR for every business in "America" will require one of those.
You've got to be kidding, I have spoken to D* many times about many things, and have NEVER GOTTEN a foreign language CSR.....I really do not believe that.

sytyguy

Phoenix AZ HDTV

i just moved to the area, how current is the list of unencrypted QAM channels?

davidhildreth

Phoenix AZ HDTV

As current as those using QAM-capable tuners tell me. I update the list based on their input since I use the SA8300HD DVR.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

It's current as of 9/3 when I posted the last update. Dave, you might want to update MNTV to show 720p since they're doing HD now, update the date on the complete list to 9/3, and remove the extraneous [/quote] at the end of it.

Also, anyone else feel like calling KASW to complain about the lack of audio tonight? I already called about the video 90 minutes ago and that looks fine now, and I called about the lack of audio half an hour ago but it's still silent. There's a 2.0/384k audio stream there, just seems to be silent.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Thanks, it's been updated.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

BTW. Are Girlfriends and The Game any better without audio?

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Looks like they finally went back to the SD upconvert and the audio is back. And yes, Girlfriends and The Game are much better with no sound . It's not that I really care about these shows, but if they don't work out the bugs on these, I don't expect much for the shows that I do watch.

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Good comeback! I'm sure we all believe you.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Now that Gilmore Girls is going downhill fast, there's really not much to draw me to CW, but as long as I'm still watching, I want KASW to not suck. Even if I watched none of the shows on it, I still want it to be good because outside of WPSG Philadelphia, I think we're the largest market to have a full-bitrate CW station. Have to have something to hold over the rest of those bums in the programming forum

coyoteaz

Phoenix AZ HDTV

ROTFL, that's as good a reason as any. FWIW, I admit to watching Smallville and Veronica Mars, even 7th Heaven in SD, so I'm with you all the way.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Hi All,
Weird thing during Desp. Housewives: halfway thru show the Center Channel audio stopped working yet I could still hear background music/sounds. I could not hear what they were saying, just music in background. At commerical break audio was OK. Lasted about 10 minutes, (just enough to ruin the show) then audio came back in full.
Anyone else experience this? Or is this my system specific? I use SageTv and OTA, Nvidia PureVideo Audio, spdif digital audio to receiver.

Randy

wheelrandolph

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Yes, it is not your equipment. I switched over to analog for several minutes and when I heard an audio pop there, I switched back and all was back to normal.

DoubleDAZ

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald V
I just talked to the news desk at ABC15 and they hope it will be up and working in time for the world cup match in 30 minutes...

Donald
Let's hope so

JesseH

Phoenix AZ HDTV

KNXV is back up for the world cup match!

Donald

Donald V

Phoenix AZ HDTV

KNXV 15 hd feed is ba ck online. Let the game begin!

DrBombay

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Picture looks pretty good so far...only DD2.0 sound though...

Donald

Donald V

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Update on QAM:

Was having issues with the SIR-T451 not catching most of the HD channels so I managed to pick up a LG box (3510a). It found everything on the list as posted but there is still no 76 at all and 80-1 is WB (WTF!) So no matter how hard I try no NBA-HD for me. /cry

Still waiting for someone to report a set top box that receives all the QAM channels correctly.

There isn't much to choose from and the LG's themselves are discontinued (3410a/4200a/etc)

Boofster

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruprick
How would one do this w/o HDTV tuner built-in to the TV? I just bought a Samsung OTA tuner (QAM compatible) using Silver Sensor antenna, thanks to you guys for the great tips. The samsung receiver only has a coax in (taken by antenna) and I am using the DVI-out to the hd-monitor. Currently I am only getting the OTA signal, no QAM.

I also have Cox basic cable and will be using my Tivo box as a tuner, using s-video out into the hd-monitor.
I still haven't been able to figure out how to get both OTA and QAM using this receiver. I have Cox basic cable, but this receiver only has one coax input (being used by the SS antenna). I assume a coax has to be fed into the receiver from my wall...but how is that possible when it is already occupied by the antenna?

Lastly, I've read this entire thread specifically the first post stating the different QAM channels. If I'm receiving the OTA channels flawlessly should I really be concerned about the QAM channels? Do any of you enjoy the QAM channels in addition to the OTA ones? WGN stood out as well as a couple of others.....but I guess I'm wondering if I should even be worrying about this.

ruprick

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Bad news for all you PC/Mac users out there... Cox-Phoenix has finally turned on the "copy-once" flag on all Premium channels. Locals, ESPN, INHD1&2, and UHD are the only ones left as "copy-freely"

This is a very sad day for me...decision time...do I cancel my cable or buy a D-VHS deck.

MickeyDora

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruprick
I still haven't been able to figure out how to get both OTA and QAM using this receiver. I have Cox basic cable, but this receiver only has one coax input (being used by the SS antenna). I assume a coax has to be fed into the receiver from my wall...but how is that possible when it is already occupied by the antenna?

Lastly, I've read this entire thread specifically the first post stating the different QAM channels. If I'm receiving the OTA channels flawlessly should I really be concerned about the QAM channels? Do any of you enjoy the QAM channels in addition to the OTA ones? WGN stood out as well as a couple of others.....but I guess I'm wondering if I should even be worrying about this.
Perhaps your receiver can only receive one or the other at a time, which Samsung model do you have?

If your receiving the OTA channels perfectly than why bother with QAM, they both have the same PQ.

I do receive both OTA (via DTivo) and QAM (via HTPC), on separate TV's.

HTH,

Rich

sytyguy

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruprick
I still haven't been able to figure out how to get both OTA and QAM using this receiver. I have Cox basic cable, but this receiver only has one coax input (being used by the SS antenna). I assume a coax has to be fed into the receiver from my wall...but how is that possible when it is already occupied by the antenna?

...If I'm receiving the OTA channels flawlessly should I really be concerned about the QAM channels?...I guess I'm wondering if I should even be worrying about this.
Get a $8 passive RF A/B switch from RatShack, if you are really interested in the QAM channels. Or just disconnect the SS temporarily to view QAM.

There are two reasons to do this:

1. There may be content on QAM channels not available from the OTA channels. Only you can determine if this makes it important or not.

2. If the DT transmitter goes down, you may still be able to get the local channel. This will not likely be an option until analog cutoff in 2007, because currently Cox receives DT OTA also, and has no immediate plans to add direct fiber sources from the local channels to the Broadcast Fiber Ring.

For now, I suggest just a temp hookup until you are familiar with the content.

TomCat

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by MickeyDora
Bad news for all you PC/Mac users out there... Cox-Phoenix has finally turned on the "copy-once" flag on all Premium channels. Locals, ESPN, INHD1&2, and UHD are the only ones left as "copy-freely"

This is a very sad day for me...decision time...do I cancel my cable or buy a D-VHS deck.
Mick...

Are you saying that this would affect only some Cox recordings done to a capture card? Why would it not affect DVHS or PVR recordings? How about if the source is DBS?

Also, does this really affect things that much? I think most people are OK with making one copy. Sorry for the ignorance.

Let us know how your DVHS quest goes, if it goes that direction. I'm thinking of going DVHS also.

Cheers

TomCat

Phoenix AZ HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by sytyguy
Perhaps your receiver can only receive one or the other at a time, which Samsung model do you have?

If your receiving the OTA channels perfectly than why bother with QAM, they both have the same PQ.

I do receive both OTA (via DTivo) and QAM (via HTPC), on separate TV's.

HTH,

Rich
Samsung SIR-T451

ruprick

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