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Question Tyler TX HDTV ( AVS Forum Local HDTV Info and Reception )
Updated: 2008-06-16 04:03:19 (753)
Tyler TX HDTV

After purchasing a HD television set about four months ago I finally decided it would be nice to actually view some HD programming. What options other than going with a DBS provider are available? I currently subscribe to Cox digital cable and have to admit that the SD channels whether analog or digital actually look pretty decent on my 55 inch set. Of course I have never seen any HD material so what do I know. I have contacted Cox several times regarding the future availability of HD on cable, but they pretty much seem clueless so I assume it may be some time before it is available. I would like to stay with Cox at least for the internet service since DSL it not available at my address.

Are any of the locals (KLTV, KETK, KFXK) actually transmitting a DTV signal that you can receive and if so do they provide any network HDTV programming? I also read in the paper that the Nacogdoches NBC affiliate was moving to Tyler and would become a CBS affiliate sometime in the next three months. Since they are building a new tower closer to Tyler do you think they will have DTV transmitter up and running at the same time their new analog transmitter becomes operational?

I picked up an HDTV tuner on ebay, but could not receive any DTV signals with an indoor antenna. I could receive all the local analog stations with the indoor antenna. I would not mind installing an outdoor antenna if there is a chance I could receive any OTA DTV signals.

Any thoughts or information would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Answers: Tyler TX HDTV ( AVS Forum Local HDTV Info and Reception )
Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtrot
I just looked at ABC Monday Night Football, and although it is clearly HD, it doesn't seem as sharp as ESPN college or pro football games. Could just be the lighting or particular cameras for this game.
I noticed this too, but I saw something I've never seen before. After most changes in camera shot, it would look very out of focus for a second and then within 4 seconds, I would notice that the picture had very gradually corrected. With camera shots changing every 5 to 10 seconds, I had to watch closely to ensure I wasn't just imagining the brief periods of sharpness.

I would assume MNF uses the same type of camera and production equipment as ESPN Sunday Night Football but I've never seen this problem on Sunday nights. I wonder if this is a production issue or something to do with the KLTV engie's decoding workaround?

Either way, my hat's off to the KLTV engineer for finding any kind of workaround.

RickInTyler

Tyler TX HDTV

Yes, I also noticed the blurriness with camera changes. Kind of aggravating. I thought it was possibly because my antenna is not pointed right at the tower, but I seem to have a steady signal.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

This is an update on my attempt to pull in HD channels from Shreveport using an inexpensive antenna rigged up on my back patio here in Tyler.

I'm using three 5ft. antenna mast sections from Lowes for a 15ft height, and a medium range directional antenna that I bought from antennas direct (a website). I live in a duplex near the intersection of ESE Loop 323 and Troup Hwy.

I'm currently able to get a solid HD signal (very few glitches) from the following Shreveport channels:

KSLA - CBS - 12.1 (17)
KTBS - ABC - 3.1 (28)
KMSS - FOX - 34.1 (34)
KPXJ - UPN - 21.1 (21) this is actually in Minden, LA

All 4 of these stations come in great from the same antenna position - I hand-turn my mast to a compass heading of about 40 degrees.

I had had no luck tuning the following Shreveport channels - I don't get so much as a whiff of signal from them.

KLTS - PBS - 24.1 (25) Sniffle, sniffle - I wish I could find PBS HD
KSHV - WB - 45.1 (44)
KTAL - NBC - 6.1 (15) Actually listed as a Texarkana station.


TYLER STATIONS
============

KLTV - ABC - 7.1 (10) here in Tyler is now coming in great - signal strength appears to have increased since earlier this month because I can now pull in the station when the antenna is still pointed at Shreveport - I used to have to point it North. I'm tickled that they're broadcasting some stuff in HD now - especially MNF.

KYTX - CBS - 19.1 (18) comes in great as well, but I have to point my antenna South. Of course, everybody here has probably been watching CBS19 for the last year.

KETK - NBC - 22.2 (22) I'm getting a very clear signal from these guys on their SD Letterbox channel, but nothing from their HD channel (22.1) - I wasn't expecting to get anything from KETK because of earlier posts I saw that indicated they were broadcasting on an extremely low power signal from down in Jacksonville. It may not be HD, but it's certainly clearer and better looking than the DirecTV local channel from NBC56. I have to point my antenna due South to pick up KETK.


DALLAS STATIONS (nada)
===================

I'm so anxious to get PBS in HD that I tried turning my rig West toward KERA in Dallas. While I was at it, I tried all the Dallas stations but came up with nothing at all.

Looking at a topo map, I don't see any large hills in my way, but my antenna isn't up and over my roofline, so I'm probably just in my own house's shadow... Either that, or the distance and curvature of the Earth is just to much to overcome with my current rig.

RickInTyler

Tyler TX HDTV

mtrot, in a post earlier this month, you mentioned you're near Rieck and Copeland...

I'm not sure what your mast height is, but it seems to me that you're in the shadow of that huge hill over on Paluxy - the same one that the Eagle's Nest subdivision sits atop. That hill sits almost directly between you and Shreveport, so I'm suprised you're able to get any Shreveport channels.

You also mentioned in a different post that you were able to pull in a Dallas station to watch the World Series. Was that in HD? Have you tried tuning Dallas' digital stations?

I've got a buddy in Chandler that relies soley on DirecTV for HD content, and am wondering if it might be worth the small investment to try and pull Dallas channels in OTA.

Cheers,
-Rick

RickInTyler

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickInTyler
KSLA - CBS - 12.1 (17)
KTBS - ABC - 3.1 (28)
KMSS - FOX - 34.1 (34)
KPXJ - UPN - 21.1 (21) this is actually in Minden, LA

KLTS - PBS - 24.1 (25) Sniffle, sniffle - I wish I could find PBS HD
KSHV - WB - 45.1 (44)
KTAL - NBC - 6.1 (15) Actually listed as a Texarkana station.
Although KPXJ is licensed to Minden, it transmits from the KTBS tower in Mooringsport.

KSLA is only running 175kW, but must have a very high antenna, as their signal at my location is just as good as KTBS, KPXJ, and KMSS all running 1MW.

KLTS is currently only runnning 57kW and apparently have no plans to upgrade their power. Louisiana is in a budget crisis and I don't see them spending any money to upgrade their public television network any time in the future. They don't even make it into Gregg County, and I think that KLTS is doing SD only at this time.

KSHV is running a 1kW STA from a short stick in downtown Shreveport. Their signal barely covers the city. Their CP calls for 500kW from Moorignsport.

KTAL is running a 15kW STA from their tower in Vivian. They don't make it into Gregg County. Their CP calls for a full 1 MW.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickInTyler
mtrot, in a post earlier this month, you mentioned you're near Rieck and Copeland...

I'm not sure what your mast height is, but it seems to me that you're in the shadow of that huge hill over on Paluxy - the same one that the Eagle's Nest subdivision sits atop. That hill sits almost directly between you and Shreveport, so I'm suprised you're able to get any Shreveport channels.

You also mentioned in a different post that you were able to pull in a Dallas station to watch the World Series. Was that in HD? Have you tried tuning Dallas' digital stations?

I've got a buddy in Chandler that relies soley on DirecTV for HD content, and am wondering if it might be worth the small investment to try and pull Dallas channels in OTA.

Cheers,
-Rick
Well, I think I may be looking a little north of Eagle's Nest, but it may be blocking to some degree. Another problem for me trying to get Shreveport is that my antenna is on the south side of the house, and is actually "looking" through the roof of the house in that direction. If I rotate it towards KYTX or KETK, it has a better shot. Of course, KLTV is strong enough that it doesn't have to be pointed at the tower. I might be able to get Shreveport with an amplifier, but it is not that big a deal to me, now that I can get CBS and ABC in HD. Fox doesn't have a lot that I like to watch, except for House.

I don't think I ever was able to pick up any Dallas stations at all. I don't remember posting that. I did try to get FOX out of Shreveport for the World Series games, but came up dry.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

fm346 & 756
I've got a big annenta on a pole on the top of my house with a rotor and a pre amp.
All I get reliably is abc & cbs & nbc from Tyler.
I thought I was getting 3.1 abc until I tried to watch a Monday Night Football Game
The first night I had the set up I got fox from shreveport but have not pulled it in again & never during the daytime.
Lucky for me I have DierctTV and was granted waivers from FOX & CBS so I'm granfathered with those waivers.

gshamill

Tyler TX HDTV

Just for fun, I created a pdf for all the Shreveport and Tyler digital channels, including sub-channel information, power, and construction permit details.

Let me know if I have made any errors.

12/13/2005 - A rescan discovered the following changes:
  • Added 19.2 KYTX-UP. It is assumed that this will be UPN on 1/1/06.
  • 33.1 KMSS-HD is now showing up as KMSS 1
12/12/05 - Corrected description of 3.2. Corrected details about 24.1, 24.3, and 24.5. Added 5.1 to Dolby Digital note. This specifies 5.1 programming. All ATSC channels broadcast with Dobly Digital audio. Only select channels and programs are in DD5.1.

12/6/05 - Updated to add DD symbol to channels 3.1, 33.1, and 7.1. Corrected id's for channels 33.1, 7.1, and 7.3

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

I can confirm KLTV has 5.1 audio up and running, both on ball games and other programming.

Now, if we could just get KYTX to step up.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

I found out today that KYTX' 5.1 audio is scheduled for 2nd quarter '06.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

I did a rescan on my STB yesterday and noticed a couple of changes:

1. KYTX now has a sub-channel

19.2 KYTX-UP

I am assuming that this will be the new UPN channel that is scheduled to start on 1/1/06. They are currently just showing the standard def version of CBS-19.

2. 33.1 KMSS Shreveport is now showing up as KMSS 1, instead of KMSS-HD. This may indicate that they are about to put a sub-channel up, although currently only 33.1 is on.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Hello all. New to forum. Just spent an hour looking over this years threads. I feel like I hit the motherload on HDTV info for Tyler.

Thanks to CBS (ch 19/18-1) for getting the ball rolling!

Can I get a copy of the PDF that was created with all the stations.

thanks

samintyler

Tyler TX HDTV

Registered and went to find the pdf. Thanks I have it now.

samintyler

Tyler TX HDTV

I was just flipping through the HD channels on Cox, and noticed that channel 720 is now KLTVHD.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

During tonights news broadcast, just before the weather, KLTV announced that they were up and running in High Def. So it is official now.

Question - why is it some channels are showing up as 7-1, 7-2, etc and yet they are officially chan 10?? how does all that work?

samintyler

Tyler TX HDTV

10.1, 10.2, and 10.3 are "re-named" 7.1, 7.2, and 7.3, I think because their original analog channel is channel 7. The .2 and .3 channels are sub-channels, which require some of the 19.2 mb/s stream that could and should be devoted to the HD signal. The .2 is a weather channel, while the .3 is just their analog signal.

I don't understand why they do these sub-channels, because the only people that can see them are the people with HD setups, but what they want is the best HD picture they can get, and have no reason to tune to the .3 sub-channel anyway. Duh.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by samintyler
During tonights news broadcast, just before the weather, KLTV announced that they were up and running in High Def. So it is official now.

Question - why is it some channels are showing up as 7-1, 7-2, etc and yet they are officially chan 10?? how does all that work?
The reason that they are officially channel 10 is because KLTV-DT is broadcasting on channel 10. The analog and digital signals can't reside on the same channel, so each analog channel was assigned a digital channel to use until the digital transition is over, which has now been pushed back until 2009. After 2009, many stations will return to broadcasting their digital signal on their old analog channel, and some will stay on their transition channel. There will be no more channels above 50, and low-VHF (2-6) has proved pretty much unusable for digital television. I believe that KLTV has elected to return their digital signal to channel 7 when the transition is complete.

The digital channels are maintaining their analog channel id as a convenience to their viewers. The people of East Texas have been used to KLTV being on channel 7 for 50 years. Now telling people that they are on channel 10 is just going to confuse a lot of people. The channel mapping on a digital set top box (STB) is seamless. It simply scans, receives KLTV-DT on channel 10, then maps it to the old channel 7, along with any sub-channels received.

There is a lot of debate on the use of sub-channels. True HD aficionados are going to want the entire 19.2 Mbit/s bandwidth devoted to HD. People who don't care as much about HD like the extra content provided. Stations are beginning to realize that these sub-channels are can be an extra source of revenue, so I think that you will see the use of sub-channels increasing. In DFW and some other cities, some digital channels are broadcasting cable channels via a service called USDTV . Several stations together form a small, 20 or so channel digital cable service. The USDTV boxes sold at Wal-Mart are used for this service.

Now, as to why KLTV is using a sub-channel to rebroadcast analog KLTV is kind of a mystery. My theory on this is that they are planning to use 7.3 as the source for analog cable systems. By using analog via digital OTA delivery, they can forego the use of expensive fiber cable connections to local cable systems. 7.1 would not be a good source for analog cable, as changing aspect ratios would not be tolerated by the cable companies' customers. BTW, KPXJ-DT in Shreveport is doing the same thing - HD on 21.1 and SD on 21.2.

Just my 0.02.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

The question is, will the level of picture quality afforded by HD at 14.5mb/s be acceptable to consumers after they get a look at the HD quality of movies and other content on blu-ray disc, which looks to provide in the range of 30 mb/s data rates???

The level of pixelation and blurring that is going on with ABC and CBS HD sports broadcasts is really annoying to me. Plus, people are paying a lot of money to be able to receive HD, and are not going to expect to have to put up with these problems.

It is my hope that this competition from HD-DVD picture quality, along with a dearth of actual viewership of sub-channels will "encourage" the OTA HD broadcasters to return to using the full 19.2 mb/s bandwidth.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

My sources at KFXK tell me that on Jan. 1, analog KCEB-54 will become a WB affiliate. KLPN-58 and KTPN-48 will become independent.

"Beginning January 1, 2006, KCEB will become a WB broadcast station.

As you mentioned, KLPN/KTPN's affiliation with UPN will cease as of that
same date--KLPN/KTPN becoming Independent."

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

I live just east of Broadway Ave off R.E. Lee. I have a 45 db gain rabbit ear ant and easilly receive 19-1 and 7-1. I also see 7-2 and 7-3 but there is no reception on those channels.

Would I increase the number of channels or improve my reception with a) an outdoor ant? b) an add on around the sat. dish ant? or do I really need to go with a mast and rotor.

In a previous post, someone mentioned that ole' Joe would be able to goto Wal-Mart and bring home a 35" HD set and turn it on and get it all. That is what I am looking for without all of the additional antenna stuff.

Last question, will Direct TV re-broadcast the "local" channels in high def? If so, any idea when?

Thanks. You guys are a great source for info on HDTV.

samintyler

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by samintyler
I live just east of Broadway Ave off R.E. Lee. I have a 45 db gain rabbit ear ant and easilly receive 19-1 and 7-1. I also see 7-2 and 7-3 but there is no reception on those channels.
At your location, you also should be able to get KETK-DT on 22.1, even with an indoor antenna.

Quote:
Would I increase the number of channels or improve my reception with a) an outdoor ant? b) an add on around the sat. dish ant? or do I really need to go with a mast and rotor.
Forget about the clip-on Terk crap. Terk's antenna designs try to ignore the laws of physics, but they just don't work. You might as well use a coat hanger. With a good outdoor antenna, like a Channel Master or Antennas Direct, mounted at about 30', and a preamp, you most certainly would be able to get KETK, and probably some of the Shreveport stations, like KTBS, KSLA, KPXJ, and KMSS. The problem is that, at your location, your stations are going to be coming from at least 4 different directions, so a rotor would be helpful, but not essential. Just mount the mast and leave it slightly loose so it can be rotated by hand from the ground. Note that all of area digital stations are UHF, except for KLTV. The Channel Master 4228 is a sold as a UHF antenna, but it's design makes it very useful for VHF-high. I get KLTV very well with my 4228.

Quote:
In a previous post, someone mentioned that ole' Joe would be able to goto Wal-Mart and bring home a 35" HD set and turn it on and get it all. That is what I am looking for without all of the additional antenna stuff.
Unfortunately, back to the physics theme, free off air television has always and is always going to require some type of antenna. That's why it's free. If you don't want to mess with an antenna, you have to pay a satellite or cable provider for your service, although even satellite has an antenna - it's just shaped differently. Cable too has an antenna - it's just installed and maintained by the cable company, and "shared" amongst the cable's viewers.

Quote:
Last question, will Direct TV re-broadcast the "local" channels in high def? If so, any idea when?
Directv (D*) is currently launching HD locals in major markets. I believe the top 10 markets by end of this year, then top 50 by end of next year. The claim that they can provide HD locals to everyone in the country, but Tyler-Longview is so far down the pecking order, market #111, that it will probably be at least 2007 before D* has Tyler-Longview HD locals.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Thanks for the great reply. I think I have a better picture of what I want for Christmas... :-)

samintyler

Tyler TX HDTV

As of 1/1/06, UPN is now on KYTX-UP 19.2, id'ing as UPN18. Directv has replaced KTPN-48 with UPN18.

KCEB-54 is now East Texas' WB54.

KLPN/KTPN are now independent, id'ing as 58 KLPN East Texas Television.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Any know what is going on with d* 99-1 through 99-12 and 99-50? Just happened on them today and curious.

gstove63

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by gstove63
Any know what is going on with d* 99-1 through 99-12 and 99-50? Just happened on them today and curious.
You are not talking about Directv are you? D* is typically synonymous with Directv in these forums.

D* = Directv
E* = Echostar, aka Dish Network
DTV = Over the air digital television

If you are referring to picking up these channels off the air, you are probably receiving the Dallas USDTV channels.

See http://www.usdtv.com.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

You are most likely correct that they are the USDTV channels that do not have enough signal strength for a picture. I am talking about D* and understand the abbrevs and are seeing them, not enough signal strength for a picture, with a d* h1o rcvr.

Thanks

gstove63

Tyler TX HDTV

It's not that you do not have enough signal strength to see the picture, but these are subscription channels. You have to have a USDTV receiver and valid subscription to view.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

In watching the bowl games on ABCHD on KLTVDT over Cox Cable, there was a very frequent problem of the overall picture and any on-screen graphics turning very fuzzy for a time, then getting back to normal. It seemed like this occurred primarily when they changed the camera shot.

I have noticed this since they first went on the air with their digital HD signal. I thought they would fix the problem, but it is as bad or worse now.

Did you guys see this as well? Seems like there were some others who noticed it a few weeks ago.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

I believe that the engineer at KLTV is waiting for some equipment to remedy this problem.

mp3trojan

Tyler TX HDTV

Have been watching LSU @ Tenn on CBS 19 this afternoon. It was in HD but looked horrible. Sometimes not in focus or fast scenes were blurry. Is this problem on the camera end or somewhere in between?

Dahamma

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveFitz1
I recently moved to Tyler and am now getting my HD programming via SuddenLink. Do the HD stations on SuddenLink (both local and national) broadcast anything in Dolby 5.1? I've yet to see anything but wasn't sure if it maybe I wasn't watching programs being broadcast in 5.1. Right now I'm watching football on both ESPN and KLTV and don't see a 5.1 signal. Just wondering what I should be expecting.

Thanks,

Steve
I think I have gotten 5.1 on KLTV, KYTX doesn't seem to have 5.1 yet. I am not sure about KETK and KFXK yet. I get 5.1 on DiscoveryHD, UniversalHD, HDNet, HDNet Movies, and StarzHD.

Now, sometimes my receiver shows the Dolby Digital 5.1 indicator, but the program is only in 2.0, and nothing will come out of the center channel or the surrounds.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

mtrot,

Thanks for your reply. I'm checking out a couple of channels right now. It appears the NFL game on KFXK and the golf tournament are both being broadcast in Dolby 5.1 when I view them OTA. I rechecked my connections coming out of the digital cable box and realized there was no optical digital going to my receiver. I fixed that issue and now am getting Dolby 5.1 over SuddenLink. Sounds good.

Thanks,

Steve

SteveFitz1

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dahamma
Have been watching LSU @ Tenn on CBS 19 this afternoon. It was in HD but looked horrible. Sometimes not in focus or fast scenes were blurry. Is this problem on the camera end or somewhere in between?
No, not the camera. This blurring on fast sports scenes has been that way from the beginning of CBS 19 going up with their HD. It actually is more of a pixelation than blurring.

Part of the blame is that most HD locals don't use the full 19.2mbps HD bandwidth. A lot of them use only about 12 to 13mbps for their main digital channel. Add to that the fact that they are also broadcasting sub-channels, which also uses bandwidth.

Add to that that CBS uses 1080i, and I have found that 1080i is much more prone to pixelation than 720p, although you may see that 1080i has more detail than 720p. When you see sports on KLTV HD, you won't see that pixelation, but it is nowhere near as detailed as CBS 19.

BTW, ESPNHD on SuddenLink has been getting worse and worse over time, to the point that "HD philes" have taken to calling it "HD-lite". Notice how the grassy expanse of a football field seems to "crawl" and smear, losing all detail.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

In Tyler-Longview, 7.1, 51.1, and 56.1 all pass DD5.1 audio.

In Shreveport, 3.1, and 33.1 pass 5.1 audio.

No 5.1 audio on either CBS 19.1 or 12.1, HOWEVER, I just sent an email to Phil Hurley at CBS19, and he told me that they have their 5.1 audio equipment on order, and plans to be providing 5.1 sound on 19.1 by the end of the year.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtrot
Now, sometimes my receiver shows the Dolby Digital 5.1 indicator, but the program is only in 2.0, and nothing will come out of the center channel or the surrounds.
It may be the way your HT receiver is decoding and displaying the audio stream. For instance, my Onkyo has has 2 independent displays for the sound mode. The first, smaller display, shows either Dolby Digital or PCM Digital, depending on the type of audio stream. The second larger display, shows how the stream is being decoded. It displays Dolby Digital only for 5.1 streams, all other streams, including DD2.0 and PCM, are decoded as PLII (Pro-Logic II). Your receiver may displaying Dolby Digital regardless if the stream is 2.0 or 5.1.

Also, KETK-DT has had some problems recently where the center channel is missing from the 5.1 stream. This effectively removes the dialogue track.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by gbranch
Also, KETK-DT has had some problems recently where the center channel is missing from the 5.1 stream. This effectively removes the dialogue track.
This has been painfully obvious on Saturday Night Live and on Law & Order on occasion.

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

KYTX signal strength has been lower here lately,,,60-70 vs was 75-85 always,,,
My other CBS KSLA has not been passing hd all day,,,
Center, Shelby Co. , TX

windham9

Tyler TX HDTV

No HD for us for Cowboy game. Network broadcasting in HD but our Fox station not passing it to us.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

KMSS in Shreveport carried it in HD. Another KFXK screwup.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

No Prison Break in HD either. Was for a bit but not now.

rickypro

Tyler TX HDTV

I live just south of Tyler and want to get a roof antenna to pick up the HD Locals. Does anyone know of a good antenna installer in Tyler? I've called several numbers and the dish TV/DirecTV places and they don't do it. Anyone had an antenna installed recently? Thanks!

adam61

Tyler TX HDTV

Marcus Crouch is supposed to be good, have not used him myself.

gshamill

Tyler TX HDTV

Recently having moved to Tyler and being a new SuddenLink customer, I'm disappointed to find that ESPN2-HD is not available on SuddenLink. Is anyone aware of why this isn't available and whether SuddenLink has any plans to add it?

Thanks,

Steve

SteveFitz1

Tyler TX HDTV

KETK in SD SUNDAY night NFL,,FAIL TO SWITCH to HD. Colts vs Eagles in 3rd Quarter now,,

windham9

Tyler TX HDTV

any suggestions on which OTA antenna to buy and where to buy it?

CStuckey

Tyler TX HDTV

Welcome to the Tyler HDTV board!

Recommend you first go to Antennaweb.org, type in your physical address, then post the results. That will tell us what type of antenna you need, we can then make specific manufacturer and model suggestions.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Is this the right info?


DTV AntennaType Call Sign Channel Network City State LiveDate CompassOrientation MilesFrom FrequencyAssignment
yellow - uhf KCEB 54 CW LONGVIEW TX 317? 4.2 54
yellow - uhf KFXK 51 FOX LONGVIEW TX 204? 22.4 51
* lt green - uhf KFXK-DT 31.1 FOX LONGVIEW TX 149? 7.6 31
blue - uhf KYTX 19 CBS NACOGDOCHES TX 198? 47.9 19
blue - uhf KETK 56 NBC JACKSONVILLE TX 219? 46.0 56
blue - vhf KLTV 7 ABC TYLER TX 265? 26.0 7
* blue - vhf KLTV-DT 7.1 ABC TYLER TX 265? 26.0 10
blue - vhf KLGV-LP 10 FMN LONGVIEW TX 189? 4.6 10
violet - vhf KTAL 6 NBC TEXARKANA TX 57? 51.0 6
violet - vhf KTBS 3 ABC SHREVEPORT LA 75? 49.8 3
violet - uhf KMSS 33 FOX SHREVEPORT LA 76? 49.6 33
violet - vhf KSLA 12 CBS SHREVEPORT LA 76? 50.6 12

CStuckey

Tyler TX HDTV

OK,looks like you're in NW Longview. IMO, Antennaweb underestimates the reception of digital signals in many areas of Longview. With a large, directional antenna, you should be able to get the following digital channels:

Tyler:
7.1 (RF10) KLTV-DT ABC
19.1 (RF18) KYTX-DT CBS
51.1 (RF31) KFXK-DT Fox
56.1 (RF22) KETK-DT NBC

Shreveport
3.1 (RF28) KTBS-DT ABC
12.1 (RF17) KSLA-DT CBS
21.1 (RF21) KPXJ-DT CW
33.1 (RF34) KMSS_DT Fox

6.1 (RF15) KTAL-DT NBC is supposed to come on-line with their full-power digital signal sometime in early December.

All stations are UHF except KLTV. To get the UHF stations, you need a large directional, like a Channel Master 4228, Radio Shack U-120 (which is no longer manufactured but can still be found in some stores) or an Antennas Direct 91XG. The 4228 can receive KLTV in some instances, but YMMV.

For KLTV, you need some type of VHF antenna. You might try one of the big Radio Shack V/U antennas, like the VU-190 or a Channel Master V/U combo.

Another option is to get a separate UHF and VHF antenna, and couple them using a V/U coupler or a Channel Master 7777 pre-amp, which has separate V and U inputs.

The tricky part to digital OTA in this area is orientation. You can pretty much get the Shreveport stations from a single direction, but the Tyler channels are scattered all around. If you want to get both Shreveport and Tyler, you either need a rotator or be able to somehow adjust your antenna mast from the ground. Some people have reported having success just coupling 2 antennas together, one pointed at Shreveport and one pointed at approximately Jacksonville, but if there are any multipath problems at your location it would be hard to make it work reliably. There are also multi-directional amplified antennas on the market, like the Terk, but most people's experiences with those are poor.

The Channel Master 4228 can be found at many places on-line, just do a google search.
The Antennas Direct antenna can be purchased directly from antennasdirect.com.

Just be sure that wherever you buy your antenna, you can return it if it doesn't work at you location.

Good luck.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Is it difficult to install? How do I know which direction to point it? How do I get the signal to my tv?

CStuckey

Tyler TX HDTV

ok, my question is this. i am STILL having problems with KETK 56 HD. i watch studio 60 on monday nights and it is usually fine with no problems. however, on sunday night the football game is ALWAYS pixellated to the point that there are numerous dropouts and it's unwatchable in HD. same thing for thurday night (my only other NBC night). so my question is, is it something that i am doing or should i be calling KETK?

kevin75

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin75
ok, my question is this. i am STILL having problems with KETK 56 HD. i watch studio 60 on monday nights and it is usually fine with no problems. however, on sunday night the football game is ALWAYS pixellated to the point that there are numerous dropouts and it's unwatchable in HD. same thing for thurday night (my only other NBC night). so my question is, is it something that i am doing or should i be calling KETK?
That's just the way it is on sports programming with KETK and KYTX. IMO, it is because those networks use the 1080i broadcast standard. Sports on those networks always have that pixelation most notably on close-ups of the action. If you notice football on ESPNHD, which is 720p, you won't see pixelation to the same extent.

As far as calling KETK, it would only do any good if you could talk them out of their sub-channels, so they could then use the full 19.2mbps for their main HD channel.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by CStuckey
Is it difficult to install? How do I know which direction to point it? How do I get the signal to my tv?
It's not really difficult, but if you've never put up an antenna before you might get a professional to do it. As far as aiming, antennaweb provides a direction to each channel from your location. The signal is sent to your tv via plain ole' RG6 coax.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Can you recommend a professional?

CStuckey

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by CStuckey
Can you recommend a professional?
Sorry, I've only ever done my own installations, so I don't know any installers. Take a look in the phone book. You might also call Wiltronics over in Tyler - maybe they can help.

Anyone on this board know any antenna installers? Anyone? Bueller?

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

Is anyone else not getting Fox 51.1 and 51.2 all the sudden? I tried 31.1 but am only getting thir analog signal. Everything else i receive has not changed.???????

Dahamma

Tyler TX HDTV

I'm not getting it either. High signal strength according to meter but no picture.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

I'm getting a new channel today. At least new to me.KSHVDT on 44. I guess it is out of LA somewhere. Anybody else getting it? I am in White Oak.

metlman

Tyler TX HDTV

i have 51.1 on 31.1 now funny thing is it will come in thru my dish recvier but not the tv tuner on tv says 98 strenth but no pic on tv

skeeter200c

Tyler TX HDTV

Equally strange - I get a picture on 31-1 & 31-2 with my set top digital tuner (Samsung) but no picture on my RCA with built in digital tuners and likewise with my Tivo Series 3.

Also KETK asleep at the switch the last two days, Las Vegas (Friday night) and Saturday Night Live both in SD rather than HD. Wonder about Cowboy game tonite.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

The FCC is requiring all stations to be digital by a certain date, the exact date I can't remember. However, it does not require them to be HD.

July 1, 2006 to protect their channel selection.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickypro
I was doing some work at the KFXK building in Longview today and talked to the Chief Engineer and he told me that they were doing some testing during game one of the World Series. That was why the HD was hit or miss during the game. He said they are working on getting the kinks out of the system and were hoping to have the signal fixed ASAP.
I've often wondered whether KFXK does its master control out of either Longview or Tyler.....I remembered they had a office in Tyler a few years ago, but was uncertain as to whether or not they had a control room in Tyler. I'm guessing they're still at the same Location location they've been since their days as KLMG.

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDR
The FCC is requiring all stations to be digital by a certain date, the exact date I can't remember. However, it does not require them to be HD.

July 1, 2006 to protect their channel selection.
If I recall correctly, KCEB is exempt from this because they are a newer station and that their current analog assignment will also be their DTV assignment.

And a little interesting note, after about ten months of being the WB/CW affiliate in East Texas, KCEB has replaced KWTL in the Tyler Morning Telegraph's Entertainment Showcase. Now if they would only add listings for KTPN/KLPN.

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by stdjsb25
If I recall correctly, KCEB is exempt from this because they are a newer station and that their current analog assignment will also be their DTV assignment.
Their current analog assignment, channel 54, can't be their digital assignment because channel 54 will not exist after the analog cutoff date. No digital channels will exist above channel 50.

They do have a CP for channel 38, so at some point we will either see them move their analog signal to 38 and then do a flash cut to digital at some later point, or just put a digital signal up on 38.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

hd on fox tonight! hurray.

gshamill

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by gshamill
hd on fox tonight! hurray.
HD despite a rain delay for the game......I doubt that it'll happen tonight......

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

No, the rain delay & the show that was on during the rain delay were in HD, there were 2 sound drops that I noticed.

gshamill

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by gshamill
No, the rain delay & the show that was on during the rain delay were in HD, there were 2 sound drops that I noticed.
I spent the day yesterday on the phone with the KFXK chief engineer finalizing the encoder settings and coordinating splicer configuration with FOX TOC.

Everything appears to be working normally now and FOX HD should be available on KFXK from now on.

Please keep commenting on what you are seeing over the air because feedback on this forum is a valuable asset to help us improve our product.

Lou Strowger
Chief Engineer
KWKT Waco, Tx
Corporate Engineer
Communications Corporation

FOX44CE

Tyler TX HDTV

No HD on the World Series as the telecast starts on KFXK.

rickypro

Tyler TX HDTV

yup no hd

skeeter200c

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by FOX44CE
I spent the day yesterday on the phone with the KFXK chief engineer finalizing the encoder settings and coordinating splicer configuration with FOX TOC.

Everything appears to be working normally now and FOX HD should be available on KFXK from now on.

Please keep commenting on what you are seeing over the air because feedback on this forum is a valuable asset to help us improve our product.

Lou Strowger
Chief Engineer
KWKT Waco, Tx
Corporate Engineer
Communications Corporation
Any word on when SuddenLink cable(formerly Cox) will add KFXK HD to its HD lineup?

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by skeeter200c
yup no hd
There was a problem with the newest software installed on the Tandberg HD encoder at KFXK and compatibility with the FOX splicer.

They loaded the same version we have been running here in Waco this morning and are monitoring the output of the splicer today for any further issues.

If no new problems arise they will be in HD for the game tonight.

Sorry about the delay guys but we are slaves to our vendors sometimes.

FOX44CE

Tyler TX HDTV

FOX44CE,

Thanks for keeping as updated on the KFXK HD migration. I know that new technology can be frustrating sometimes. Keep up the good work. It will be great to have 2 sources for FOX-HD programming on Sundays, as KMSS and KFXK often show different games and I can luckily receive both.

I do have a question for you - do you have any knowledge of, or are you allowed to provide us any insight into the future of KCEB-54? Primarily, I (and others on this board) would like to know if the CP for channel 38 is proceeding and if and when KCEB will be available in digital and HD.

TIA.

gbranch

Tyler TX HDTV

watching the game in hd thanks verrrrry nice

skeeter200c

Tyler TX HDTV

now if i send ya a screwdriver and you can turn that thing up to 1080p

skeeter200c

Tyler TX HDTV

Watching the game in HD on SuddenLink cable. They have it up on channel 705 on the cable box. Must be in 720p because it looks really grainy and shimmery to me.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

it is 720p but it clear as can be for me but im using a off air ant philips 29.99 walyworld works very good just no abc im in henderson. man i love my new 60inch sxrd sony

skeeter200c

Tyler TX HDTV

Well, it is clear, but with a lot of grainys in it. Sports on CBS in 1080i have more detail and a smoother picture, but are much more prone to pixelation.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

KFXK started having problems with HD immediately after the game was over and less than 30 minutes later switched back to SD where it has remained ever since. No NFL games in HD on fox this weekend. Fortunately Cowboys playing Sunday night on KETK which seems to have a better engineering staff than KFXK.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

This is mainly for FOX44CE....since he may know if this is a problem originating at KETK or my end.

I'm watching Saturday Night Live right now on 56.1 in HD......the audio is lousy. I can hear the music and the audience applause, but the dialogue is barely audible.......this is not the first time this has happened. Is this a problem on KETK's end or is it my TV?

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

stdjsb25 I had the same issue. Like the center channel was gone.

gshamill

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by stdjsb25
This is mainly for FOX44CE....since he may know if this is a problem originating at KETK or my end.

I'm watching Saturday Night Live right now on 56.1 in HD......the audio is lousy. I can hear the music and the audience applause, but the dialogue is barely audible.......this is not the first time this has happened. Is this a problem on KETK's end or is it my TV?
NOT your end I think.

Same on KETK NASCAR HD Sunday, no center, hear the cars and incar radio but no announcers. Its gotta be using the left & right 5.1 signal for the 2 channel simple stereo sound,,,,,Pic is great, rather see HD with no talking than SD anyday on sports! Just now getting a black screen? Its back,, With audio. Good job guys, before lap 10. Cowboys on NBC tonight, KETK get'er done!

KTAL to be up in 2 weeks? We'll see.

KFXK (giants-bucs) NFL is SD today, should get the bugs out soon.

KMSS Bengals-Falcons HD perfect

KSLA & KYTX- CBS NFL were both SD today, KSLA just went HD in 2nd half(Baltimore- New Orleans), Titans-Texans still SD on KYTX, low rated game may be SD from CBS?

4 Noon games, Nascar, Broncos- Colts at 3pm, Carolina- Dallas tonight, nice.

SUPPORT FREE BROADCAST HDTV!!

windham9

Tyler TX HDTV

Last night's football game was perfect....no problems.

The sound issue had surfaced before, namely during SNL and other shows on occasion, such as Law & Order:SVU. It was just not great.....I had to turn on the closed captions just to fully make out what they had been saying.

Now, if only KFXK could fix their problems.

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

REPOST OF MY REPLY FROM THE SHREVEPORT/MONROE THREAD:

KFXK is apparently back in 16X9 letterbox mode today.....however there seems to be problems with the 16X9 picture on 31.1 right now......the picture is divided into three segments.....the top features a heavily pixelated version of Judge Alex, the middle features a still picture from today's Jerry Springer airing on KLPN 31.2, and the bottom features a still picture from the end of the last segment of Judge Alex before the show went into commercial break just a few minutes ago. I sense a return to SD before 3PM.

Maybe they oughta send some people from KETK to KFXK to help fix the problem?

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

850pm watchin fox hd no problems looks nice thanks FOX44CE

skeeter200c

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by skeeter200c
850pm watchin fox hd no problems looks nice thanks FOX44CE
Well, when I rechecked about 3:55, they were looking good.....now hopefully Murphy's Law won't invoke itself again.....knock on wood.

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by gbranch
FOX44CE,

Thanks for keeping as updated on the KFXK HD migration. I know that new technology can be frustrating sometimes. Keep up the good work. It will be great to have 2 sources for FOX-HD programming on Sundays, as KMSS and KFXK often show different games and I can luckily receive both.

I do have a question for you - do you have any knowledge of, or are you allowed to provide us any insight into the future of KCEB-54? Primarily, I (and others on this board) would like to know if the CP for channel 38 is proceeding and if and when KCEB will be available in digital and HD.

TIA.
I do not know the status of KCEB or what it's future holds.

I assume that it will move to another channel because channel 54 is "out of core" for the final DTV transition.

That station is operated under an LMA agreement and I don't know the owners or their plans for the station. Sorry..........

FOX44CE

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by skeeter200c
850pm watchin fox hd no problems looks nice thanks FOX44CE
Thank the chief engineer. He's the one pulling his hair out over this.

I'm just here to lend advice and moral support.....................

FOX44CE

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by FOX44CE
Thank the chief engineer. He's the one pulling his hair out over this.

I'm just here to lend advice and moral support.....................
And you're doing a good job......on behalf of all the DTV/HDTV viewers in East Texas, we thank you.

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

I recently moved to Tyler and am now getting my HD programming via SuddenLink. Do the HD stations on SuddenLink (both local and national) broadcast anything in Dolby 5.1? I've yet to see anything but wasn't sure if it maybe I wasn't watching programs being broadcast in 5.1. Right now I'm watching football on both ESPN and KLTV and don't see a 5.1 signal. Just wondering what I should be expecting.

Thanks,

Steve

SteveFitz1

Tyler TX HDTV

I can tell you that my plasma TV will pick up the local HD on the cable just fine. That is KYTX(1080i), KETK(1080i), and KLTV(720p). Those are not scrambled. But all the other HD channels are scrambled.

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

ok, i just watched studio 60 on 56.1 on my DTV and it wasn't in HD. even last night during the football game, it was unwatchable due to all of the pixellation. am i doing something wrong?

kevin75

Tyler TX HDTV

Leno no HD tonight,,,

windham9

Tyler TX HDTV

THAT'S IT!

I'm on the verge of writing a letter to both KETK and the Tyler Morning Telegraph berating KETK for saying that they've got HD, but not putting it to use or not giving us a reason for not putting out HD programming. This is getting ridiculous and KETK is going to be left in the dust. Does anyone know if they are having problems with their equipment?

stdjsb25

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by stdjsb25
THAT'S IT!

I'm on the verge of writing a letter to both KETK and the Tyler Morning Telegraph berating KETK for saying that they've got HD, but not putting it to use or not giving us a reason for not putting out HD programming. This is getting ridiculous and KETK is going to be left in the dust. Does anyone know if they are having problems with their equipment?
E-mail response from KETK

Ketk now broadcasts in HD all the time -technically-, on over the air (Ch56-1) out of Mt Selman 5 MWatts ERP and on Suddenlink Digital Cable.
I say technically because we are in true HD only during NBC Network prime time (7-10 pm weekdays) or week end sports events.
The rest of the time, we up-convert our standard definition signal.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

i called them this morning to ask they why they broadcast the football game in HD but not other stuff and the guy wasn't aware of any problems, but said he would talk with his boss and get back to me.

kevin75

Tyler TX HDTV

I heard an ad on the radio for employees for the master control room in Longview. Any chance they are picking up some more people to be ready to go HD?

mtrot

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin75
i called them this morning to ask they why they broadcast the football game in HD but not other stuff and the guy wasn't aware of any problems, but said he would talk with his boss and get back to me.
From KETK

Studio 60, Leno and Conan should have been HD, that was an operator mistake that I will correct.
The Ryder Cup should have been HD too, same thing and that is a shame.
As for the Today Show, I am in the process of sorting some HD feed issues with the Network
We air some of our NBC programing "out of schedule" which means we switch (SD) feeds from Eastern to Central time zone.
This capability is not yet available to us for HD, (but I am looking into that).
In the meantime I am getting contradictory information from NBC as to what time zone my HD feed receiver should be set;
If I set it correctly for Today show, then Prime time is off by an hour and we don't want that.
This is the situation here at KETK right now, and I while I apologize for last night and the Rider Cup, the Today show situation might be a little more complex to resolve.
Rest assured that I am doing all I can to get as much HD as possible to my viewers, and that this is still a work in progress.

BillDR

Tyler TX HDTV

i got home tonight and checked my tivo and it had recorded 'heroes' in hd! the bad part is though that it only got about 50 minutes of it due to pixellation and freezing issues.

kevin75

Tyler TX HDTV

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtrot
I heard an ad on the radio for employees for the master control room in Longview. Any chance they are picking up some more people to be ready to go HD?
Quote:
Originally Posted by stdjsb25
FOX44CE...any word on the KFXK HD installation?


This was Fox44ce's response on the 27th,

"The encoder for KFXK has arrived and it they will be integrating it with the FOX splicing system this week. Hopefully up for the games this weekend."



rickypro

Tyler TX HDTV

I'm going to be moving to Tyler this month. Who do I contact for cable service? Is it still Cox or do I now look for Cebridge? Based on the discussions in this forum, it appears there is an HD package available. Is that correct? Also, is there an HD DVR available as well?

Thanks for the information. Moving to a new place is always fun!!

Steve

SteveFitz1

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